Amp hunting-- advice wanted

[wastoid]

hey there, post #2

Some of you may have read my first post where I described having temporarily owned a Rectoverb combo. I bought this because I was impressed by the cleans that it gave me and I love that thick creamy recto distortion that I could get out of it as well. I had some problems with the reverb circuitry when switching between channels, so ultimately I returned it.

Now I'm trying to figure out what I should aim for. I play a lot of jazzy/funk type stuff and I really want solid cleans that don't break up quickly but I also love metal riffing (like thick 7 string black metal type stuff). I know the ultimate solution to so much diversity is to have more than one amp, but I'm trying to keep things simple and make a compromise if I have to for now.

So given that I liked the Rectoverb, I started to wonder if maybe the Single Rectifier solo head would be nice for me? I haven't found one to try out yet. Also, can the Dual Rectifier do everything sound-wise that the Rectoverb can and then more? (ignoring the reverb of course).

It also seems like the Mark IV comes up sometimes when talking about metal so I'm curious how that one sounds in person (haven't found one of those to try out either). Stores seem reluctant to carry these around here.

What I *did* manage to try out was:
- the Lonestar (gain channel weak for metal, but as I understand this is primarily a blues/clean type amp, for which it sounded amazing).

- Stilletto seemed cool, but its distortion was more brit crunchy than I like (maybe this is because of the EL34s and that could be changed?). I don't really know, but it just wasn't doing it for me like the recto distortion does.

- Express 5:50-- again, seemed to have pretty weak gain and be more useful for blues/funk but I'm not sure.

- Roadster/Dual rec/Triple rec/Road king. I think I tried all of these but they all had so many settings (particularly the Road* ones) that I wasn't really sure what the hell I was doing lol... So that's why I'm curious about the Dual Rectifier, since it seems like maybe it'd give me the tone I wanted without a million options?

So I'm sorry for rambling a bit but I would really love some advice. My current list of possibilities assuming I can get a chance to try them is:
- Dual Rec
- Single Rec (not rectoverb)
- Mark IV

If there's something you guys can recommend for or against given what I've described here. I'd be very greatful. Money isn't a big obstacle for me since I've been saving up for this for a while now; I just want to get something that's really good and lets me get the kind of diverse tone that I want.

If it might help with giving advice, I also tried Orange amps out but their clean channel felt kind of dry and boring to me. The gain was okay, maybe somewhat similar to the vintage mode on the rectos, but I didn't feel like it would be possible to push it to the point of a recto's Modern channel by any means.

thanks in advance

 

[wildrat666]

Roadster!!!!!! great cleans and nice gain channels.tighter than a dual recto.
you got reverb too.
best mesa i´ve played on(ok th mark 4 was good too)
good luck. test all amps you can

 

[MrMarkIII]

Mark III. Dey rool.

 

[wastoid]

I spent the last 4 hours reading posts here and I think it's between the Roadster and the Mark IV now.

So hard to decide this stuff! I'm going to Guitar Center this Friday and I'm hoping they will have a Mark IV. Somehow I doubt they will, considering the demand for them, but if they don't, I'll be awfully tempted to pickup the Roadster if they have one!

 

[clutch71]

There is no demand for the Mark IV. They are rarlely stocked, it's kind of a "know what your getting into amp." Rule out the Single, it may or may not have the same switching issues that the ROV had. I've never experienced any switching issues with a Dual Rec (other than a bad soldering joint in the old single ended footswitch). The Roadster is prone to popping when switching channels. This can sometimes be remedied by cycling through the channels n stand by but can come back.

Footswitches in this series has always made me shake my head.

 

[wastoid]

There is no demand for the Mark IV. They are rarlely stocked, it's kind of a "know what your getting into amp." Rule out the Single, it may or may not have the same switching issues that the ROV had. I've never experienced any switching issues with a Dual Rec (other than a bad soldering joint in the old single ended footswitch). The Roadster is prone to popping when switching channels. This can sometimes be remedied by cycling through the channels n stand by but can come back.

Footswitches in this series has always made me shake my head.

This is the kinda stuff I was hoping to hear, thanks. I'll check out whatever I buy for these problems. Part of why my OP above seemed so confused is because I've read so many conflicting stories here and I'm not sure how to balance it all.

The RoV foot switch issue I had was the weird swell that occured when changing channels. It's supposed to be that way by design but I believe mine was exceptionally screwed up; even the guy in the guitar store said "I'd never accept it like this." The swell volume was as loud as any note I was playing, which was pretty ridiculous.

So I really hope the Roadsters don't have the same reverb circuitry... if they do and I hear the same sort of pronounced swell (which I doubt, since it really seemed like something was wrong with the amp), then I'll be back to the drawing board.

 

[rizboog]

the road king for me does it all, but I have had one to play with for a while. I know what it can do. Rethink your decision.Mine roars, F----kin roars, and the cleans are pristine. There is everything in between. No amp has so many tones, NO AMP. Take your time.

 

[wastoid]

the road king for me does it all, but I have had one to play with for a while. I know what it can do. Rethink your decision.Mine roars, F----kin roars, and the cleans are pristine. There is everything in between. No amp has so many tones, NO AMP. Take your time.

cool, thanks for the input. Tomorrow is my shopping day so I was hoping to hear some more but I think I blabbed too much to get many bites.

The Dual Rec vs Roadster thread has been interesting enough to read though!

 

[jdurso]

the only issues i can think of with the roadster (and BTW i love mine even with these issues)... the popping but once you cycle through the channels in standby your good..... there is a slight delay between channels... its very slight but i notice it.... the reverb if set too high has a slight swell on the clean channel.... its not anything like its broken and its very subtle.... none of these are deal breakers for me because when you set this puppy up right its pure bliss especially with an eq in the loop to dial in exactly whats in your head

 

[metal190]

+1 to Jdurso.

It sounds like what you want is an amp that can cover a lot of ground. That, my friend, is the road king or roadster. Bear in mind that they will have a slightly different tone than a straight up dual rec, and a lot of guys will even argue that they have slightly different tone from each other. Anyway, if you want an amp that you can play jazz and funk with, the RK II allegedly has the greatest clean channel ever made (the lone star's). Yet it has the balls to the wall drive for metal riffing with a 7 string. That's exactly what I wanted and exactly what I got with my RK.

So why get a Mark IV? Because you like the tone more. Still a very very versatile amp. But the real reason that soooo many people die for their Mark IVs is because the tone is awesome. So listen to clips of both or play both if you can. Decide which sound you want more, because they're very distinct. Then weigh in how much you care about having an additional channel to play with. You mentioned that you wanted to have multiple amps but could only practically have one. Well read what Mesa says in their spiel on the Road King. That's exactly what they're going for.

 

[wastoid]

Well, I spent a few hours playing a Roadster and a Dual Rec at Guitar Center. I think the Roadster must have been messed up because I wasn't able to get it to get that really thick and creamy recto growl, whereas I had no prob dialing it on the Dual.

I was definitely able to hear the sweet cleans on the Roadster you guys were talking about. I also noticed the channel changing pop thing but thanks to you guys, I knew to just shift through the channels on standby and that took care of that swiftly. It still did the hideous reverb swell thing though, but I think I would probably just not use the reverb much if I were to buy one.

I've read a few people here say that the Roadster makes the Dual Rec obsolete, so if that's even close to the case, I'm thinking about just ordering a Roadster and not buying one from GC (since they are pretty notorious for having abused gear). Also, still haven't had a chance to really try or hear a Mark IV in all its glory.

btw, what do you guys think of using an Orange 4x12 with these heads? I've heard of a few people doing it and they seem to really like it, but there's a "safe" impedance mismatch and I was wondering just how much headroom on your cleans you'd lose due to that.

thanks for reading my babbling ;p

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I haven't tried the Orange cabs, but here is my 3 cents when it comes to these amps. I've owned them all.


Rectoverb: great cleans, crappy reverb, great distortion tones. The solo is good to have too.

Roadster: Couldn't get my head to sound anywhere near as good as the combo that I tried in the store, but they were both very early serial numbers. Great cleans, great reverb, great distortion tones. I found that I only used channels 1 & 4 though. Footswitch is fucking HUGE!!!! Way too many gadgets that I thought would be cool, but just never got used.

Mark IV: I've had both the A & B versions. Decent but sterile cleans, good Reverb, great distortion tones, hard to dial in. It seemed like every room meant that I had to change my settings. While this is to be somewhat expected, these changes seemed too drastic to me. R2 was crap, I don't play enough Rolling Stones music to care for it. Footswitch size is manageable, but big. You have to open this one up a bit to get to the really great tones.

2 channel Dual Rectifier: Terrible Cleans, great Distortion, lots of usable options. No Reverb.....

Tremoverb: Sounded incredible on both channels, Reverb was very decent, but no Solo function. I should have kept this amp and used an EQ or Fat Boost in the Loop.

DC-10: Still have this one. Great Cleans, Great Distorted tones, Reverb is not as good as my LSS, but still really nice. I use the EQ for a footswitchable Solo boost. This is a really great, but often overlooked amp.




If I had to do it all over again, I would definitely get another T-Verb but the DC-10 gets me as much distortion as I could really want.


Here is what I still own:

DC-10 - see above

Heartbreaker head: Severely modified, not done yet, but getting very close to what the amp should have been originally.

LSS 1x12 Combo: I just got this one, but I've owned more Boogies than I can remember. I really love the Cleans and the Blues tones. The Distortion tones with Humbuckers or Singles is really nice, but not Metal. You would have to use a pedal for that. This is by far the best clean that I've ever used, and that includes the few Vintage Fenders I've had. The only gripe that I have so far is the delay in Reverb when switching channels, but I'm going to figure out a great mod to get rid of that.



OK, you thought you rambled. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[jdurso]

Well, I spent a few hours playing a Roadster and a Dual Rec at Guitar Center. I think the Roadster must have been messed up because I wasn't able to get it to get that really thick and creamy recto growl, whereas I had no prob dialing it on the Dual.

I was definitely able to hear the sweet cleans on the Roadster you guys were talking about. I also noticed the channel changing pop thing but thanks to you guys, I knew to just shift through the channels on standby and that took care of that swiftly. It still did the hideous reverb swell thing though, but I think I would probably just not use the reverb much if I were to buy one.

I've read a few people here say that the Roadster makes the Dual Rec obsolete, so if that's even close to the case, I'm thinking about just ordering a Roadster and not buying one from GC (since they are pretty notorious for having abused gear). Also, still haven't had a chance to really try or hear a Mark IV in all its glory.

btw, what do you guys think of using an Orange 4x12 with these heads? I've heard of a few people doing it and they seem to really like it, but there's a "safe" impedance mismatch and I was wondering just how much headroom on your cleans you'd lose due to that.

thanks for reading my babbling ;p

i played a roadster the other day at a GC in Tempe (i was travelling and needed to get my fix).... anyway i dialed in almost every channel exactly the way i do with my own (minus the eq in the loop) and it didnt sound the same as mine..... well it was in the ball park but it wasnt as tight and sounded dull .... i think it was because of two things.... the tubes were probably on their way out and/or the differences between the 4x12 recto cab at GC and my Basson/Diezel cabs i have at home..... i think it had a lot to do with the cabs but the amp just had less of everything (gain/volume) when compared to mine

 

[wastoid]

OK, you thought you rambled. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Read every word.

Thanks again guys. I hadn't been thinking of the Tremoverbs, though I did hear good things about them while researching this stuff. There's a used one at a store around here for 1.4k right now (might be able to talk them down a bit), I might go check it out but it's a bit of a drive. Is there a point with the Tremoverbs where they were really good or bad? Like "all Tremoverbs after 1990 sucked!" -- that sorta thing?

It's starting to seem like I'm eventually going to just have to bite the bullet and buy something, since apparently I need a Boogie bachelor's degree to dial in good tone on these things in stores.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I think the T-Verbs were all good. There were a couple of revisions, but I do not know what they entailed.


I've just recently acquired an LSS. The distortion is really good with humbuckers, and absolutely sings with a Fat Boost in front of it.



I would say, try the T-Verb. They have been going for $1,200 to $900 on ebay lately.

If you don't like it, try the LSS, or a DC-5 or 10.

 

[ja22y]

I've not come across any amp that can go from jazz/clean to metal.
For me I would look for the best clean tone since they are the hardess to find, and can get you to heavy crunch. For metal, with the right pickup and pedals you can get to the '70s metal. The modern death metal stuffs is another story, I have no experience there.
Everyone knows that the LS or LSS has great clean, but most people for some reason have the wrong perception that they don't do dirt. I found that with a high gain humbucker, it can get pretty heavy, well heavy enough for me like AC/DC, early Sabath, ...

 

[wastoid]

I ended up ordering a Roadster. The 30-60 day wait begins! Now I just have to decide what cabinet I want to use with this thing. I'm still pretty luctant to venture into the 4x12 world because I have a relatively small car and am a relatively small dude, but man is it tempting.

It seems like people rave about Avatar cabs for their value so I'm considering getting one of those. I'm just not sure what speakers would be best for which style of music. So many decisions!

 

[Monsta-Tone]

If you want a light 2x12 that sounds incredible, try a THD out.


I have one and it is awesome. Weighs only 46 pounds, has Mojotone speakers, and sounds like a 4x12.

I also have a Lonestar 2x12 cab with Hella-Tone 60L's in it that sounds incredible.




Keeping with Mesa, I used to use my 1st Dual Rectifier with a 1x12 3/4 back cab w/C90 speaker. I bet 2 of those would rock the house.

If that doesn't have enough bass for you, try a 3/4 back and a Thiele w/EV.


4x12's sound great, but I wouldn't lug another one around if I had to. I'm 5'11" and 200 pounds, and work construction (don't have the beer belly though) and I don't want to move anything that big anymore. Not when I can get the same sound out of 2 2x12's.

 

[wastoid]

If you want a light 2x12 that sounds incredible, try a THD out.


I have one and it is awesome. Weighs only 46 pounds, has Mojotone speakers, and sounds like a 4x12.

I also have a Lonestar 2x12 cab with Hella-Tone 60L's in it that sounds incredible.

Keeping with Mesa, I used to use my 1st Dual Rectifier with a 1x12 3/4 back cab w/C90 speaker. I bet 2 of those would rock the house.

If that doesn't have enough bass for you, try a 3/4 back and a Thiele w/EV.

Wow, that THD sounds pretty nice. I just read up on it a little bit. Only 46 pounds! It's hard to believe it really sounds as huge as the bigger 2x12 cabs. I'll definitely consider ordering one of those. I saw one on craigslist used recently too-- it's too bad I didn't realize what I was looking at.

 

[MikeK]

2 channel Dual Rectifier: Terrible Cleans, great Distortion, lots of usable options. No Reverb.....

hmmm.... I get some pretty nice cleans outa mine :shock:
maybe its because those preamp stages do that chunky distortion so well
switching out of them pales in the comparison .... 8)