Addressing the Mark 2C+ vs. the Mark V Discussion

[jhhead]

hey guys whats up? i know all of the discussions and opinions on the mark v 2c+ setting not sounding like or as good as a acual mark 2c+. i happen to have been a very proud owner of 4 mark 2c + amps in my life. at one point i was running 2 of them in my rig. one was a simul class with reverb and graphic eq, the other was a simul class w/ reverb, no graphic eq. the mark 2 c+ without the graphic had more attack and pick response than the head with the graphic eq. i ran a 5 band eq pedal for it and it just tore up the heads with the graphic. i always wondered why. but when i got my new mark v i found it sounds better than the graphic eq 2c+ i have. now i know why. if you have an owners manual it tells you how they came up with the mark 2 channel on the mark v. they based it off of a mark 2 WITHOUT the graphic eq because they felt it had a more rounded sound due to a part in the heads that was affecting the amps with the graphic. which that is what i heard yrs ago but never understood why. so i think the people who say that they dont think that the mark v covers the 2c+ well is because they never played out of a non graphic eq 2c +. most were made with the graphic eq. i have been playing metal for yrs and yrs so i am pretty anal about my tone,and that is my tone results 10 yrs before the mark v ever saw the light of day. but im not an engineer so i couldnt tell you why that is,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,until now, lol.

 

[eudaimonia02912]

Do you think the IIC+ mode on the V (with the graphic EQ off) sounds as good as one of the non-EQ Mark IIC+s? Would you recommend that people try an external graphic EQ in the loop instead of the V's graphic EQ?

 

[jhhead]

i acually tried hooking up my old footpedal eq into the mark v and shut the eq on the head off. the eq in the head sounds way better. this amp is a monster. it needs nothing other than a noise gate for loud high gain,or use an mxr chorous pedal for cleans, which i use. trust me find your sweet spot with just the amp, it tears heads off. the only things i run are an mxr smart gate,mxr chorous,mxr tremolo and mxr evh flanger for some cool guitar lines and breaks. i run all of them through the fx loop. thats it!!! all my tones really are from just the amp and i have gotten umteen compliments at our show last week. but get this,,,i used my 2c+"s prior to this and havent gotten the compliments im getting with this amp. over the last 13 yrs i have had the old 2 channel dual rec, the 3 channel triple rec, i also had a tri axis and a strategy 400 power amp running stereo. it comes down to this amp. i am a boogie man through and through. but they have out done themselves this time.

 

[sted]

I had an unbiased view really as ive never owned a boogie before so it was all a big history lesson for me on the IIC+ mode and how they re-created it, I guess opinon will always be split but the only thing that matters to me is that it sounds brilliant, I cant make my mind up whether I prefer the MIV or IIC+ mode for leads, not really a terrible decision to have to make is it? :lol:

 

[sprada]

jhhead u seem what ur talking about regarding mesa amps.
It's a bit off topic but care enough to share your settings?
I'm specially interested in tha mean 3rd channel high gain.

Tks dude.
Cheerz

 

[MBJunkie]

Great post Jhhead. While I have never owned or even played a IIC+, I can definitely relate to what you are saying because I came up with a similar conclusion after recently A/B'ing my MkIV Widebody Combo to the "IV and Extreme" modes of my MkV Combo. I followed the "suggested comparison settings" provided in the MkV manual and sure enough the amps sounded nearly identical to each other. MkIV amp presence pulled out = IV mode of V. MkV amp presence pushed in = Extreme mode of V. However, I find that the MkV can cover a much larger range of excellent sounds in even just the IV or Extreme modes than can my MkIV Widebody Combo. The V can easily handle larger amounts of the bass tone knob and seems to have more gain on tap than my MkIV widebody (especially in the "IV mode" of the V). I find that some of my best hi gain sounds are achieved with the gain set in its middle ranges (10-2 o'clock). In fact, this is also true of my other tone controls (especially treble and presence). The V also offers a normal / bright toggle switch for Ch3 which makes a significant difference in all modes. Lastly, the V also offers the IIC+ mode which I often use as well. IMO the V is the best amp Mesa has produced to date, and that is saying a lot!!

 

[jhhead]

hey guys these are my settings

in mark iv
gain 2:30
mast 4:00
presence 2:30
treble 2:30
mids 10:30
bass 11:00
my eq is on sliders. now on the graphic slides the 80,240,2200 hz sliders even with the word sliders on the left of the eq for the second channel slider/preset switch. so all of those 3 sliders are boosted evenly. the 6600 is boosted a little past half way. the 750 is cut to when you see the bottom of the slider right at the lowest line of the eq ( right about where the 3 is on the sides of the eq)stop there,dont cut it completely.

mark 2 c+
the only diff here is on the gain knob go up to 3:30 bass knob to 12:00 and slightly boost the 80 hz more. and switch to triode on the back. let me know what you think.

 

[richb]

view post below.

 

[richb]

hey guys i'll let you know first hand about the Original IIC+ VS the IIC+ mode in the MK V
first let me start off by saying i've been playing Boogie amps for more than 20+ years and although i've tryed the other high end amps Mesa's has and will always be my home to stay so with that said,i've owned 2 original C+'s (a loaded 60w with simlu and a fully loaded simlu)(there are some pic's posted up on this forum).I am Happy to now own a Mark V and once i knew it was gonna happen and heard a IIC+ mode would be a option i had my doubts that it would sound like a vintage +.
after having owned a crap load of Boogie amps i consider myself someone who can dial these amps in within a few days and believe me there is a sweet spot in ALL of these amps.when i bought home the V it actually took me a few days before i even opened up the box and when i did i found myself setting up a staple point for the + mode.my mind was open enough to where i didnt find myself setting up the + mode like my original + i started everything @ 12:00 and worked from there.(thats one hugh mistake alot of people make,thinking you can set up your amp like you fav artist's amp settings)it just won't work!your bedroom isn't a arena although mine is because there is NO volume limit where i live in N.Y.)so after about a hr or so i got a good sound from that + mode but right off the top is just doesn't compare to a original IIC+
i A/B it the next day after more tweaking and NO dice!Not even close!!!
I didn't buy it for the fact that it has a IIC+ mode,i bought it for the other options it offers.the cleans are Amazing def better than a original +,the crunch mode is awesome and so is the MK IV mode.the MK 1 mode is def the toughest mode to tweak but working with the sliders you can get a serious smooth creamy tone and if you like to play Lagato,this is your mode!
out of all the options,the IIC+ mode is my least fav so on ch 3 it's set for the MK IV tones.
hopefully this will help some of you guys understand what this hype was all about and not to put this mode down because it is a beast in it's own-right,it's just not a real IIC+ beast.


Uploaded with ImageShack.us
Richb

 

[JOEY B.]

i have been playing metal for yrs and yrs so i am pretty anal about my tone.

There is a good joke in this statement, but I will let it slide. :wink:

I will still stand by my original comment. The C+ mode of the V sounds very similar to the original when both amps are dialed in per the Mark V user manual instructions. The problem is that these settings are not optimum for my gear, ears, etc... The comment about urgency and attack makes me wonder if the "METAL" crowd would not be happier with a hybrid tube-pre/Solid State power amp design. The 60/100 is more dynamic than a Simul, and the 180 watt Coliseum C+ is well beyond the 60/100. With or without the EQ.

My '85 has new electrolytic capacitors (filter and bias supply), and is EXTREMELY DYNAMIC, even in the 15 watt setting.



The Mark I mode (with the Mafia approved settings) is my favorite sound out of the Mark V, followed closely by Tweed,10 watt, cranked wide open.

 

[jhhead]

hey guys i'll let you know first hand about the Original IIC+ VS the IIC+ mode in the MK V
first let me start off by saying i've been playing Boogie amps for more than 20+ years and although i've tryed the other high end amps Mesa's has and will always be my home to stay so with that said,i've owned 2 original C+'s (a loaded 60w with simlu and a fully loaded simlu)(there are some pic's posted up on this forum).I am Happy to now own a Mark V and once i knew it was gonna happen and heard a IIC+ mode would be a option i had my doubts that it would sound like a vintage +.
after having owned a crap load of Boogie amps i consider myself someone who can dial these amps in within a few days and believe me there is a sweet spot in ALL of these amps.when i bought home the V it actually took me a few days before i even opened up the box and when i did i found myself setting up a staple point for the + mode.my mind was open enough to where i didnt find myself setting up the + mode like my original + i started everything @ 12:00 and worked from there.(thats one hugh mistake alot of people make,thinking you can set up your amp like you fav artist's amp settings)it just won't work!your bedroom isn't a arena although mine is because there is NO volume limit where i live in N.Y.)so after about a hr or so i got a good sound from that + mode but right off the top is just doesn't compare to a original IIC+
i A/B it the next day after more tweaking and NO dice!Not even close!!!
I didn't buy it for the fact that it has a IIC+ mode,i bought it for the other options it offers.the cleans are Amazing def better than a original +,the crunch mode is awesome and so is the MK IV mode.the MK 1 mode is def the toughest mode to tweak but working with the sliders you can get a serious smooth creamy tone and if you like to play Lagato,this is your mode!
out of all the options,the IIC+ mode is my least fav so on ch 3 it's set for the MK IV tones.
hopefully this will help some of you guys understand what this hype was all about and not to put this mode down because it is a beast in it's own-right,it's just not a real IIC+ beast.


Uploaded with ImageShack.us
Richb

is that your mark 2c+ in this pic? because if it is, then you didnt read the manual or compare it with a non graphic 2c + before posting your results. remember its not supposed to sound like a 2c + with a graphic. both of my mark 2 amps sound very different from the other. one with eq and one without. i run a 5 band eq into the non eq head and it still has a different tone. to it. even when i shut the eq off on the mark with the eq and compare raw tones with no eq on both. the non eq head is cleaner sounding and a little more thin as far as low end.

 

[jhhead]

i have been playing metal for yrs and yrs so i am pretty anal about my tone.

There is a good joke in this statement, but I will let it slide. :wink:

I will still stand by my original comment. The C+ mode of the V sounds very similar to the original when both amps are dialed in per the Mark V user manual instructions. The problem is that these settings are not optimum for my gear, ears, etc... The comment about urgency and attack makes me wonder if the "METAL" crowd would not be happier with a hybrid tube-pre/Solid State power amp design. The 60/100 is more dynamic than a Simul, and the 180 watt Coliseum C+ is well beyond the 60/100. With or without the EQ.

My '85 has new electrolytic capacitors (filter and bias supply), and is EXTREMELY DYNAMIC, even in the 15 watt setting.



The Mark I mode (with the Mafia approved settings) is my favorite sound out of the Mark V, followed closely by Tweed,10 watt, cranked wide open.

 

[jhhead]

i have been playing metal for yrs and yrs so i am pretty anal about my tone.

There is a good joke in this statement, but I will let it slide. :wink:

I will still stand by my original comment. The C+ mode of the V sounds very similar to the original when both amps are dialed in per the Mark V user manual instructions. The problem is that these settings are not optimum for my gear, ears, etc... The comment about urgency and attack makes me wonder if the "METAL" crowd would not be happier with a hybrid tube-pre/Solid State power amp design. The 60/100 is more dynamic than a Simul, and the 180 watt Coliseum C+ is well beyond the 60/100. With or without the EQ.

My '85 has new electrolytic capacitors (filter and bias supply), and is EXTREMELY DYNAMIC, even in the 15 watt setting.



The Mark I mode (with the Mafia approved settings) is my favorite sound out of the Mark V, followed closely by Tweed,10 watt, cranked wide open.

lol, thats a good one. but the jokes on you. you live in alabama. lol

 

[JOEY B.]

lol, thats a good one. but the jokes on you. you live in alabama. lol

It's not all flat tops and banjos, trust me. :wink: The stereo/double slave Boogie hooked to one guitar. :shock:

 

[germangallardo]

lol, thats a good one. but the jokes on you. you live in alabama. lol

It's not all flat tops and banjos, trust me. :wink: The stereo/double slave Boogie hooked to one guitar. :shock:

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

 

[>Photi G<]

You lucky *******. 3 C+'s and a MK1! Is the long head a Series 300 by any chance?

 

[JOEY B.]

You lucky *******. 3 C+'s and a MK1! Is the long head a Series 300 by any chance?

The long chassis head belongs to forum member "lesterpaul" and it is a Series 300. It had a facelift by "gts" after this pic was taken. It now sports wine red taurus tolex and a wicker grille. I sold the Mark I a couple of years ago. The C+ combo has been converted into a head and 1x12's (flame maple & wicker).

 

[theroan]

So jhhead, are you saying that the V was in fact comparable to your non eq C+? Is that a comparison of the V without any graphic eq? Have you compared your non eq C+ with a pedal eq to the Mark V with the eq engaged?

 

[phyrexia]

I sold the Mark I a couple of years ago.

::sniff:: shoulda bought that one :lol: