yet another "help me pick an amp thread. take 2

[rocknroll9225]

i already posted this in the rectifier forum, but i thought id put it here too so i could get both sides' opinions. sorry if this is a heinous crime, im pretty new to forums.


Im looking into getting a mesa amp, because, well, to be completely honest theyre the best amps ever made. I play and listen to just about every style from classical to thrash metal, but at heart im mostly a rock/metal guy. my favorite bands are avenged sevenfold and dream theater, to give you some idea of the sound im going for. and im more of a lead player, but great rhythm tone is just as important to me. I currently own a Marshall JVM410H and a 1960A 4x12, and i honestly believe its a pretty awesome amp, but i think im more of a mesa guy. the JVM just doesnt get that "balls to the wall" distortion that a boogie can get. that combined with the sh!t build quality of the JVM has converted me. the idea of not having to rebias my amp after every re-tube is another cool feature. anyways im trying to decide between the 2010 reborn dual rectifier, the mark v, and the road king. Ive gone to some local stores and ive been able to try all 3 next to each other, all through rectifier (oversized, not stiletto) cabs, so i think it was a fair assessment of each amp and how they stacked up against each other. i know just about all there is to know about these 3, but i, for the life of me, cannot decide which to get. in a perfect world, id just buy all 3. but i dont have that much money.

ill start with the dual rec. it sounded just as i expected to. like a dual rectifier. aggressive, huge, kinda fizzy, with lots o' boomy bass. and just to clarify i didnt mean any of those words in a negative sense. i loved the way it sounds. great clean, too. squeaky clean. only things id be nervous about with this amp:
- no fat clean mode. i really like this mode on the other mesa's, and im into more of a full bodied clean tone so im not sure how well this would work for me.
- no reverb. i really only use reverb on my clean and lead sounds, but reverb adds a lot of fullness to both of those.
i love the bottom end of the rectifiers, but ive found that it can get in the way when youre trying to play more articulate riffs. that and ive heard that the huge lows of the rectifiers dont exactly work the greatest in a mix. im also curious to try a dual rec with a tube screamer as ive heard that they tighten up the lows. any comments on that are welcome.

next, the road king. this is the amp that ive been most seriously considering, but lately ive been wondering if i would really use all the extra features and if they are worth the money. the fat clean mode and the reverb are big for me. that helps a lot with clean and lead tones. the tweed and brit modes were nice, but i have a really hard time imagining myself using them very often. theyd no doubt be nice to have, but i just dont know how necessary theyd be. id be playing mostly rock/metal, so i dont think the tweed mode is absolutely necessary. and the brit mode was good, but not great. i personally preferred the crunch mode on the mark v. and if i really needed marshally crunch id just use my JVM. then theres the cab switching system, which is completely unnecessary for me. i cant really afford two cabs anyway, not to mention the pain in the *** it would be to haul around another cab. i could get the road king cab, but then theres the hassle of micing both speakers at shows. its a good feature for pros that can afford cabs and have roadies to haul around their sh!t, but not so much for the rest of us. the feature i was most excited about was the progressive linkage. but when i went to try the amp out, i liked the 6L6's better. for just about everything, besides the brit mode. the EL34's sounded smoother to my ears, and didnt bite as much. compared to the 6L6's, they just sounded kinda dull. correct me if youve had different experiences.
the road king was in general, a little less aggressive than the regular dual. it was slightly darker, which i guess is better for solos, and felt a little bass-ier. do you guys prefer the aggressiveness of the dual or smoothness of the road king?

and finally, the Mark V. there werent a lot of things i didnt like about this amp. the cleans were awesome, but not quite as full sounding as the road king's cleans. channel 2=delicious. not much else to say. my favorite setting on channel 3 was in the MK IV mode, with a moderate V on the sliders. i gotta say, that got pretty **** close to the dream tone i hear in my head. the extreme setting was good, but sounded a little harsh to my ears on the higher wattage settings. maybe i just didnt have enough time to get to know it well enough. the extreme mode did however put quite a bit of bass in the sound, but it was still articulate. the mark v's high gain channels in general sound a little thin compared to the rectos just because they dont have the ridiculous bottom end, but i guess its supposed to be much better for playing in a mix. and as always, the mark lead tones were awesome.

i just figured id share my thoughts on these amps and id love to hear your opinions as to which one you think i should get. and if i said anything stupid/wrong go ahead and correct me.

 

[screamingdaisy]

I don't normally get into the 'help me pick an amp threads' as who am I to know what you need?

But I'm bored, so...

For reference, I currently have a Mark V, LSS and a Dual Rectifier... and I've owned a bunch of others in the past.

to give you some idea of the sound im going for. and im more of a lead player, but great rhythm tone is just as important to me.

Mark V.

ill start with the dual rec. it sounded just as i expected to. like a dual rectifier. aggressive, huge, kinda fizzy, with lots o' boomy bass. and just to clarify i didnt mean any of those words in a negative sense. i loved the way it sounds. great clean, too. squeaky clean. only things id be nervous about with this amp:
- no fat clean mode. i really like this mode on the other mesa's, and im into more of a full bodied clean tone so im not sure how well this would work for me.
- no reverb. i really only use reverb on my clean and lead sounds, but reverb adds a lot of fullness to both of those.
i love the bottom end of the rectifiers, but ive found that it can get in the way when youre trying to play more articulate riffs. that and ive heard that the huge lows of the rectifiers dont exactly work the greatest in a mix. im also curious to try a dual rec with a tube screamer as ive heard that they tighten up the lows. any comments on that are welcome.

Rectifiers do that thick, high gain rhythm sound very well. The trick to keeping them articulate is to ease off the gain... this may sound a little weak at low volumes but it kicks in hard when you get the volume up a little. I also tend to back my bass off to around 9:00 or 10:00, depending on what I'm playing and how tight/full I want it to sound.

Where Rectifiers typically lack is in their lead tone. You can get passable lead tones out of them, but they never really sing very well. They have less compression than a Mark amp, which is great for those over the top riffs but not so great for singing leads... and by the time you get the gain up to where you need it for leads the amp starts to loose a lot of definition/articulation.

next, the road king.

Unless you feel the need to have a seperate cab for your clean tones, or the need to switch between 6L6s and EL34s on the fly I'd suggest looking at the Roadster instead.

and finally, the Mark V. there werent a lot of things i didnt like about this amp. the cleans were awesome, but not quite as full sounding as the road king's cleans. channel 2=delicious. not much else to say. my favorite setting on channel 3 was in the MK IV mode, with a moderate V on the sliders. i gotta say, that got pretty **** close to the dream tone i hear in my head. the extreme setting was good, but sounded a little harsh to my ears on the higher wattage settings. maybe i just didnt have enough time to get to know it well enough. the extreme mode did however put quite a bit of bass in the sound, but it was still articulate. the mark v's high gain channels in general sound a little thin compared to the rectos just because they dont have the ridiculous bottom end, but i guess its supposed to be much better for playing in a mix. and as always, the mark lead tones were awesome.

The Mark V has nowhere near the bottom end of a Recto, which can be good or bad depending on your needs. The Mark also has a lot more midrange than a Recto, which can make it sound a bit thin on it's own yet helps it fit perfectly in the mix with no real effort in terms of EQing.

Overall the tone is much more compressed... everyone says the Recto has more gain... and maybe it does... but my personal experience is that you can crank the gain on a Mark much higher than you can on a Recto and still produce a usable sound. Due to the compression the Mark tends to sing more and sustain longer. Due to the nature of the EQ you can set it up for a very warm, fluid lead tone with little to no sizzle, or you can go for a screaming lead with lots of top end.

To me, Extreme mode produces a much drier, tighter sound than Mark IV mode. It's based on a Mark IV with the presence pot toggled and is essentially the same idea as a Rectifier with it's power section in Modern High Gain mode, albeit with a Mark IV preamp pushing it. It's really good if you need something that crosses over a bit more into modern/Recto territory, however I prefer Mark IV mode for it's slightly more compressed feel and harmonic spread.


Typically, I use my Recto if I'm going to be playing a lot of rock. I like it for it's slightly looser feel when doing a lot of chord work. Channel 1 (vintage) is my higher gain lead tone and channel 2 (modern) is my not quite as high gain but still pretty high gain heavy tone. I only have two channels so I use my guitar's volume and pickup selector to pull the gain back for cleans.

I use my Mark V if I'm going to be playing metal or I need more versatility than the 2 channel Recto offers. Typically I use channel 1 on fat with the amp on 45w and tube rectifier on for my cleans. This gives me a bit more bounce than I'd get if I left the clean channel on 90w, which I feel makes things a little too stiff for my tastes. Channel 2 (90w) is on crunch and is my main rock tone. I turn the gain up pretty high then use my guitar's volume knob if I need a little less gain for a particular song. Channel 3 (90w) is my lead tone as well as my 'metal' rhythm tone. If I'm using channel 3 for pure leads I'll put it in triode mode for a little extra compression and harmonics... but if I need to pull off both rhythm and lead with that channel I leave it in pentode for the extra power it lends to my riffs. I'll use the solo boost in any channel if I need more volume to thicken up single notes.

 

[rocknroll9225]

thanks for the help. and in case you were wondering, i went with the mark v

 

[screamingdaisy]

Sweet.

Although I had a sound I liked within a few minutes, it took me a few months to really get the amp tweaked in. Some of it is learning the amp, and some of it is learning how to play your guitar through the amp. It takes a bit of time, but it's a very rewarding experience 'cause it sounds fückin' awesome.