What's better: Combo+Thiele or Head+Thiele+Thiele?

[phyrexia]

I seem to be going through a crisis of sorts.

I know some of you guys have had both setups. I am considering selling my combo and buying a head and another thiele.

I do like that the combo is one piece, all in one, but I am still thinking about going back to the EV for all-around usage, and that makes it a heavy heavy amp. A head and a thiele would be easier really. And then if I needed the big rig I could just use everything.

Does anybody miss the open back aspect of using a combo and a thiele?

I have eaten up some tubes and I think it was because of the proximity to the speaker. It would be nice to feel more confident putting a $50 12AX7 in my amp, knowing it wouldn't pop in a couple days.

Any thoughts?

 

[ToneAddictJon]

I don't like the sound of just thieles, they are punchy and full, but I love the spread of the open back added with it. If anything, sell your combo, get a head and an open back, that way you're not eating/killing tubes. It might take an extra trip for gigs, but it also saves an 80lb trip.

 

[Stonge]

how's an open back going to save him on tubes?? I guess I have never heard that before.

 

[Buddy]

Ask Gts to build you some cabinets .

 

[phyrexia]

how's an open back going to save him on tubes?? I guess I have never heard that before.

He's saying I'd have a head separate from the open cab. Tubes further from the speaker.

 

[JimAnsell]

personally for just playing alone, i like the sound of just a head and 1 thiele.
its very tight and focused.
if you do get two, then stack em.
they're very bassy when side by side on the floor.

 

[dodger916]

I don't like the sound of just thieles, they are punchy and full, but I love the spread of the open back added with it. If anything, sell your combo, get a head and an open back, that way you're not eating/killing tubes. It might take an extra trip for gigs, but it also saves an 80lb trip.

That's the move. I like Thieles better when combined with a combo or open back cab.

 

[jski59]

I agree with ToneAddict John. A Thiele with an open back cab and head would be the best for sound AND portability.

I just did a test with two Thieles vs one Thiele and the combo speaker in my widebody Mark IV. I much preferred the blend of the 2 different cabinets...especially when using clean and crunch sounds.

If I was just playing metal all day, I'd probably go with two Thieles, but I guess I'm mellowing with age and finally expanding my horizons.

Jason

 

[phyrexia]

I agree with ToneAddict John. A Thiele with an open back cab and head would be the best for sound AND portability.

I just did a test with two Thieles vs one Thiele and the combo speaker in my widebody Mark IV. I much preferred the blend of the 2 different cabinets...especially when using clean and crunch sounds.

If I was just playing metal all day, I'd probably go with two Thieles, but I guess I'm mellowing with age and finally expanding my horizons.

Jason

That's kind of what's happening to me Part of me thinks 'TWO THIELES BRUTLZ' and part of me thinks "But what about the tasteful jazz licks?"

What kind of speakers did you use when you did your comparison/test?

 

[jski59]

The two Thiele test was one Mesa Thiele with a c-90 and my homemade widebody Thiele with an Eminence Delta 12-pro.

I preferred the sound of my homemade Thiele with the Eminence and the widebody combo speaker which is also a c-90.

That being said, I don't really like the c-90 at all and thought about changing the combo speaker to an EV or another Delta.

When running the Thiele and the combo, I notice I scoop out more midrange...more that if I'm just running the Thiele alone. I'm not sure if the extra mids are the c-90 or the nature of the open back cab, but it's just a little too much for me.

I've just finally realized what a huge differences speakers make in your sound, so I think I'll try something new in the combo next.

Jason

 

[JOEY B.]

What kind of speakers did you use when you did your comparison/test?

It would seem that any test should have all of the cabinets using the same speaker, as to isolate this variable. Then you have the whole room size/shape thing to deal with. :? The 80 pound combo thing will take it's toll on your back, for sure.

 

[igfraso]

On the other hand, a head with reverb will introduce more hum due to the proximity of the reverb tank to the transformers than a combo with reverb.

 

[edward]

I love my Thiele cab. That said, I prefer it when used WITH an open-back combo (or open 112 cab). The Thiele alone is good, but an open cab along with it is better, complimenting the EVM and the tight Thiele cab nicely IMHO.

Edward

 

[phyrexia]

I should just buy a Mark IV and another thiele anyway. Right? :twisted:

 

[Restless Rocks]

I'm currently running a combo/theile both with EV's. I can't stand the combo by itself but I have an open back cab w/EV that sounds pretty good by itself when sitting flat on the floor. The openback/theile combination is my fav. The only thing I run into is sometimes who ever is running sound doesn't want to use two mic's. (One on each cab) and this is pretty much essential to capture the full sound I'm hearing on stage. When I have to make a choice I mic the theile.

 

[nomad100hd]

if the theile is overly directional try using a weber beam blocker which will cause the sound to spread more.

 

[phyrexia]

I haven't had a problem with directionality of the thiele. I have a beam blocker on my combo actually. If you look at the specs for the thiele cab (as I understand them, anyway) the sound spread is >110 degrees on both axis, IIRC. Nothing like a open back cab but better than, say, a 2x12 recto cab, again IIRC cause I haven't had the recto cab in a long time.

I think it takes two mics just to get a good recording of the thiele. One on the cone and one on the port. I was amazed at what a mic pointed at the port sounded like. I think you need to blend the two sources to get the best results. I am still a recording noob though. I haven't had a chance to record for a couple weeks so I haven't tried it with two mics but this is my feeling.

 

[ramalam]

Using high quality NOS tubes, I never had a tube problem with 100 watt Mark I & II combos, at high volume, with EVM speakers. It is the wimpy new stuff that can't take it.

 

[phyrexia]

I must just have bad luck. I've killed 3 NOS tubes in my amp since I've owned it, all in different positions. Only one new tube (a ruby) has died.

Hell, every tube store I've asked has said "probably you shouldn't do this" when I ask if it's worth it to drop the money on a NOS tube to go specfically in my III Combo. KCA, Doug, Tubedepot all told me to use other stuff.