Uh Oh. Nomad Trouble!

[stev0griffin]

Hey guys

I've had my Nomad 100 watt head for about 6 or 7 months now, and I love it. I've got it running through a 1980s Marshall 212 cabinet and the thing just roars.

However, over the past few weeks, I've noticed it's gotten incredibly muddy sounding.
I bought new tubes (power AND preamp) and replaced all tubes inside only to find out it's still incredibly muddy.

I took it in to my nearest Guitar Center and played her through a Budda 412 and a Mesa 412, and yet again, it's still muddy.

This is driving me crazy. I want to play my amp as much as I can, but it's sounding bad and making me not want to!

To describe the mud, it sounds like the mids and bass are always kind of booming. I fool around with the EQ and GEQ in every way I can think of. If my tone is lacking something, I just bump it up a little and it gets muddy. It's doing this to both channels 2 and 3. Channel 1 stays crystal clear, even when in pushed mode.

Please, any help on this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys.

 

[R_ADKINS80]

May be a bad capacitor or some other failing component inside the amp. Try cleaning the tube sockets and all the jacks and pots with electrical cleaner. To clean the tube sockets just spray the cleaner on the tube pins and run it them in and out of the sockets a few times. to clean the pots and jacks pull the chassis out and hose em down real good while turning all the knobs. Let it air dry for a while and plug it back in and see if it helps. While you have the chassis out closely examine everything and look for failed/failing components: IE browning or burnt resistors, swelling/burst capacitors, burns on the boards ect ect. I have even seen cases of crunchy critters that crawled across foil runs and made dead shorts, pun intended. If all looks good and the cleaning doesn't help then take it to a good amp tech for a thorough diag.

 

[stev0griffin]

Thanks man, I'll definitely do all that. I hope it's just something like that and not a major repair issue.

 

[R_ADKINS80]

Cool man, let us know how it turns out. Also I thought I remember a thread on here from a while back talking about pots going bad on Nomads but i'm not sure which model it was. Try searching for "bad nomad pots" or something similar to that.

 

[nomad100hd]

Couple things, the nomad stock is a somewhat muddy or dark amp call which ever. Could be you have not noticed this till recently. If it's a bad pot u should be able to tell when u use the pot. I had some relays go bad on me, which affected my clean channel differently but similar to how u described. However i think dude who changed them, normally i do my own work but the relay thing stomped me. Must have made a bad solder joint cuz now my clean channel sometimes goes mud mud mud. However i bet i just need to get in there and check the solder joins associated with the relays. I called mesa and its' cheaper to have them fix it than the tech at sweetwater. If ur brave enough to take ur amp apart i'd appreciate some virgin nomad shots before u pull the boards yada yada.

 

[Dolebludger]

Have you tried turning your individual channel masters down and turning your overall master up? With my Nomad 55, I've found that this is a very sensitive relationship. With higher overall setting and lower individual master setting on the masters, there is less mud. And just a little tweak makes a bunch of difference. And have you checked your trebles, because a little goes a long way on these. Finally, have you checked your gain knobs to ensure they haven't been "bumped up" too far? A problem with the Nomad is that these highly sensitive control knobs have no numerals or "pointers" on them, so that they can be accidentally changed in transport, and the change is difficult to see.

 

[nomad100hd]

I agree with dolebludger MV point! I actually modified my amp to take out the mud, and it's a real simple mod.

 

[nomad100hd]

I agree with dolebludger MV point! I actually modified my amp to take out the mud, and it's a real simple mod.

 

[lyman]

I usually yell at 'em to pack up their tents and take their goats off my property. That does the trick.

uh.....wait, maybe I misinterpreted the threat title. :wink:

 

[stev0griffin]

Well, I'm absolutely terrified of taking apart my Nomad. I've got a friend who's the tech at a local guitar shop, I'll see if he can help me out.

As far as the master volume and output settings, I've tried that as well. The gain isn't dimed or anything, it's around 2 or 3 o'clock on both channels 2 and 3.

The thing that stumps me though, is that the clean channel, isn't muddy at all. Even when I use the 'Pushed' voicing and have the gain cranked.

Also, I've noticed that when I use an overdrive pedal in front of the amp, it loses mud considerably.

Unfortunately, I'm beginning to feel it may not even be worth the hassle. I don't think it's the pots because they don't have the 'Dead Spots' I've read about. Also, if it's anything beyond tubes, like I said, I'm terrified of making any changes because it's an older amp and has no warranty.

Thanks for all the responses guys, and that last comment about the Nomads took me by surprise!

 

[Dolebludger]

There are a bunch of variables going on here. If your Nomad formerly worked OK for you, and now does not, The issue has just about got to be that some setting is off or some part or parts have malfunctioned. If Ch 1 is fine, I would check my owners' manual and see which pre amp tubes drive Chs 2 and 3, and replace them as a first step.I know, you said they were new, but they might be defective. If that doesn't help, contact nomad100hd and get his instructions for the mod. I wouldn't do this myself either, but since it is simple, your amp shop shouldn't charge you much.

At what volume are you playing? Practice, small club, or arena? At practice volume your distortion will be almost entirely from your pre amp tubes. As you crank it up, power amp tube distortion comes into play, and this should not be as muddy.

 

[MusicManJP6]

The mod that nomad100hd came up with is very effective at tightening up the Nomad and making it brighter. But, if you are saying that it used to not be as muddy then a component (part) must have 'gone south'. Your tech friend should be able to find the cause. If he finds the cause and you still want it to be less muddy then have him do the 'mud mod' (as I call it) while he has the chassis out.

This may sound silly, but i've thought my amps have sounded muddy, dark, undefined, etc before.... And then I change my strings and think, "Well ****! That sounds ten times better!". Prob not your problem, but it's not out of the question. Haha.

 

[nomad100hd]

strings r a good point, also when i first got my nomad i was inlove with the sound. It was later i realized how muddy it was. I always found the distortion channel especially 3 to show he mudd not the clean. Also have u changed pickup height at all that makes a difference.

Don't be scared of the amp, i called mesa to see how much it would be for them to fix it. Ongoing clean channel problem with relays had a local shop fix it once, didn't know it was relays or would have myself anyways. Mesa quote was like $170 for the repair. that's cheaper than having it fixed local, local was almost $300! I'm adventurous so it's only natural for me to take apart things, maybe u should build a pedal or 2 then tackle the amp!

 

[MusicManJP6]

strings r a good point, also when i first got my nomad i was inlove with the sound. It was later i realized how muddy it was. I always found the distortion channel especially 3 to show he mudd not the clean. Also have u changed pickup height at all that makes a difference.

That's a good point - after the honeymoon phase wears off you start to hear things that bug you about your tone. Pickup height can add mud too like you said...

 

[Koreth]

I'd recommend taking the amp to a tech who knows Mesa amps in your area and that you know you can trust. If you don't know who that might be, you should be able to look up authorized Mesa repair centers in your area. Take the amp to the tech and have him give it a thorough inspection, checking everything out, making sure all the components inside the chassis are still properly connected, within spec, functioning properly. The pots on these amps can get damaged. When I first got my Nomad, at least half the pots on each channel had been banged in and didn't work properly. Channel 3 was muddy as hell, Channel 2 sounded thin by comparison. My tech was able to repair all the pots, and then my amp worked as it should.

 

[Tommy_G]

Just because you put in new tubes, doesn't mean you put in the rights ones.

There's been a lot of discussion as to the best lineup of tubes for this amp, and Doug's tubes recommendations fit near identical with what I found after tens of hours of flipping tubes in and out.

The other thing is that the 'modern' and 'vintage' switches severely change the amount of mud. I run both Ch2 and Ch3 in Modern, which is way brighter than on vintage. I simply can't use vintage because the tone is so muddy.

 

[Tommy_G]

Ok, wrote a response, and it seemed to disappear, so here I go again:

Just because you put in new tubes, doesn't mean you put in the tubes that sound right in this amp. Doug's Tubes has the right lineup: he came to the same tube lineup as I did, and I spent tens of hours flipping tubes in and out.

Also, if you run ch2 or ch3 on vintage, you will have mud. Flip the switch to "Modern", and things will be a lot clearer and brighter. Re-EQ and get used to "modern" if you are not running it this way already.

 

[nomad100hd]

or mod the amp!

 

[KozMcCharlie]

I've done the Mod that Nomad100 came up with and it worked quite well... However, I think that the 2 gain channels on the Nomad are loaded with too much low end on the EQ. Especially with a band. I'm running with the bass knob just above 0 on both of those channels and it's really good.

 

[nomad100hd]

here again i think that a lot of that is in the power amp. The mode i suggested stopped highs being dumped to ground, but if u want to focus the bass more u would change the .047 coupling caps to .022 in the power amp. Would make the amp punchier as well.

Also the power amp has a fixed presence level, that is not very bright. You could changed the fixed level or put in a pot.