Triple Rec EQ in loop or no?

[jamesfarrell]

Have no idea what I'm doing. So let's just get that out of the way, LOL
I have an MXR 10 band EQ. Is it better to run it through the loop or after the OD boost in front of the amp?
Sounds better in the loop. Just wondering what other folks do?

Trying to get rid of that awful flubby bass frequency. I think maybe it's just a tone inherent to the Rectifier. I had a rack recto with a 2:90 years ago, but don't recall if it suffered from this particular flubby sound I'm talking about. My other amp is a MK-V. I run an X-drive biyang TS clone in front of the amp. I have a maxon OD-9+ on the way as well as a Dougs Tubes Metal Rectifier set, minus the rectifier tubes (guys gotta eat too you know?)

Both my MKV and Tri Rec are atop Rectifier 2x12 Mesa closed back cabs.

 

[vick1000]

I use a custom built OD with bass cut capability, and a noise gate, you don't need a 10 band. I don't run anything in the loop, but you could add reverb or delay if that's you thing. I would trade your Maxon for a Seymour Duncan 805, or Way Huge Green Rhino, or a Build Your Own Clone of some sort. I currently like the BYOC Parametric Multi-Band Compressor, and it works wonders as just a clean boost, which works for me. You can add variable compression to two seperate signals, split by the crossover. So you can optically compress lows/highs and cut/boost with the level control, cutting that flub while boosting highs above the freq you choose. A semi difficult build, but some one can do it for you if you cannot.

http://buildyourownclone.com/collections/compression/products/parametric-multi-band-compressor

The MXR works horrible as a boost, becasue it adds so much noise. It works well as a a cutting tool, but you can get the same from the type OD I listed above and add a little harmonic content at the same time.

 

[TRENCHLORD]

With the 9pro+ try this; +/- a notch.
toggle- normal
drive- 9:00ish
tone- 10:00ish
level- max-ish

volts- 9v if on battery, 18v if on adapter (eats batteries waaaaay too fast on 18v)

With the od808 I always use the normal "clean boost" settings (0, noon, max), but the pro+ in normal has less compression on 0.


I've never really liked an EQ in the loop with Rectifiers.
The MXR-6 isn't bad out front with a slight mid-hump. I didn't find it too noisy running after EMGs, but for passives it's always an OD/boost.

 

[cyber104]

I've used the same EQ that you have in the effects loop on multiple Rectifiers - both Single, Dual and Rectoverbs. I think they work just fine in certain situations - yours is a good one. The only complaint that I have is that if you don't switch off the effects loop or the pedal then you color the sound of all 3 channels (or 2 channels). One way to take care of this is to use a loop master. I use a loop master looper/switcher on my Rectoverb head and run the EQ in the clean loop. Works very nicely.

I guess what I'm saying is that if it sounds good to you go with it.

 

[jamesfarrell]

I tried it out front, sounds kind of dead. In the loop it seems to add some more life to the amp.

 

[cyber104]

I have a Peavey JSX head that I have as a spare for other bandmates - an EQ in the loop of that amp has totally transformed it in a good way (Also run it thru a Mesa 2x12) - so it doesn't surprise me that it is working well in the loop for you.

Glad you found the sound you were looking for

 

[afu]

What I'd do in the loop:
1) Set all flat and then
2) Drop 31 almost completely
3) Drop 62 by 5 dB
4) Increase 125 by 3 dB
5) Tune that to sound natural

I do a similar thing with my Nova's parametric eq for the vintage mode, from time to time. The 6L6 loves lows and the Recto can get 'em. You can tune it after you find the offending frequencies and remove them. I wouldn't really want to boost very much other than to: offset something that's been cut a little and regain it; or a total 'gain' increase to have a clean boost. Cutting the frequencies sounds more natural for rhythm (which I assume this is for). Lead is a whole other thing and does benefit from boosting in some cases (the frowning mid-boost, for instance or a mock-wah setting).

In the loop, you're allowing those frequencies to be amplified and distorted before the cut. In front, you're removing them before they can be amplified and distorted. Either way works, depending on what your goal is. In front requires more finesse to sound natural and doesn't need radical changes. If put in front, I'd place it first to be sure those frequencies stay down and play dead.

The other option is to turn your bass control down all the way and then turn it up until the bottom kicks in, but before the really low frequencies get wumping.

Good luck.

 

[cabbageclutcher]

This is a digression before i chime in on the Rec tone subject. I was long time Marshall fanboy and avoided Mesa for a few reasons. Firstly, I'm in my late forties and most if not all of my favorite bands growing up used Marshall...ala Led Z, Maiden, Priest, ect, so it's probably a generational thing. Secondly, access to purchase/test drive equipment in a small town; and living in Canada doesn't help(small market). And third, the tones i heard via artists or the internet...YES I KNOW overly compressed and all that...weren't that impressive...overly processed to the point of being benign or heard before a thousand times . Anyway, i had an opportunity to purchase a Triple Triple this week and i am totally BLOWN AWAY! That finally leads me to this subject about Tone. I had ZERO, and i mean ZERO problems achieving spectacular results on all channels in very little time without the usual complaints about flubby bass, gets lost in the mix, doesn't cut, buzzy, ect. From Fenderish cleans to Marshall to Mesa tones in no time without the need for EQ's. There is literally a Million tones hiding in that box and with a cheap $30 dollar Bad Monkey in the front end i was n Heaven. It's the first time in a long time iv'e been this excited about an amp...and I've had a ton of them. I will say this; it IS a particularly finicky amp when it comes to Cabs. Luckily i had a few around, including a Mesa traditional, but found my Traynor YCS 412AV2 cab(V30's)was far and away the winner. Tight Lows, great Mids (including Upper)and rounded off Highs...all those Tones and more if i wanted. So, i guess i'll be shelving the Marshall for a while and enjoy exploring some of those Million Tones.

 

[afu]

This is a digression before i chime in on the Rec tone subject. I was long time Marshall fanboy and avoided Mesa for a few reasons. Firstly, I'm in my late forties and most if not all of my favorite bands growing up used Marshall...ala Led Z, Maiden, Priest, ect, so it's probably a generational thing. Secondly, access to purchase/test drive equipment in a small town; and living in Canada doesn't help(small market). And third, the tones i heard via artists or the internet...YES I KNOW overly compressed and all that...weren't that impressive...overly processed to the point of being benign or heard before a thousand times . Anyway, i had an opportunity to purchase a Triple Triple this week and i am totally BLOWN AWAY! That finally leads me to this subject about Tone. I had ZERO, and i mean ZERO problems achieving spectacular results on all channels in very little time without the usual complaints about flubby bass, gets lost in the mix, doesn't cut, buzzy, ect. From Fenderish cleans to Marshall to Mesa tones in no time without the need for EQ's. There is literally a Million tones hiding in that box and with a cheap $30 dollar Bad Monkey in the front end i was n Heaven. It's the first time in a long time iv'e been this excited about an amp...and I've had a ton of them. I will say this; it IS a particularly finicky amp when it comes to Cabs. Luckily i had a few around, including a Mesa traditional, but found my Traynor YCS 412AV2 cab(V30's)was far and away the winner. Tight Lows, great Mids (including Upper)and rounded off Highs...all those Tones and more if i wanted. So, i guess i'll be shelving the Marshall for a while and enjoy exploring some of those Million Tones.

As a Western person, I do most things from left to right. It's something that most people in the U.S. are trained to do practically from birth. With the Rectos, dialing in a sound is about going right to left. Once I began with the gain, treble and mid, I didn't have many problems. The bass and presence are to fill in the sound and should be used as seasoning.

If a person wants a certain tone, an EQ is good to use, but you are correct that it isn't totally necessary.

 

[cabbageclutcher]

I hope my rant didn't come off as being critical of using EQ's; and if so, that wasn't my intention.
Maybe i wasn't clear...I guess luck or fortune may have played a large role in my experience. Like i said
the amp IS quite sensitive...as most people know, to cabs and speakers. I tried the usual 1960, 1960AV and a couple others with name brand speakers installed including a Mesa Stiletto/Traditional i believe it's called now...i may be mistaken. Anyway, the Traynor has almost exact same dimensions as the 1960 with V30's installed but weighs a full 15 lbs more. My guess is the 18mm Baltic Birch and the fact it's sealed very well made the difference.

 

[totosik]

A million tones ...! Agree. The triple is such a beast, even though circuitry wise in the pre-amp section it same with the dual but it really capable to do more things in term of aggression and brutality in tone. The multi-watt and non multi-watt version both are heavy and brutal as hell, don't need an eq in the loop. I find with a reissue tube screamer 808 35th edition pedal in the front the tone is really superb, beyond the Maxon OD 808.

 

[cabbageclutcher]

This is a digression before i chime in on the Rec tone subject. I was long time Marshall fanboy and avoided Mesa for a few reasons. Firstly, I'm in my late forties and most if not all of my favorite bands growing up used Marshall...ala Led Z, Maiden, Priest, ect, so it's probably a generational thing. Secondly, access to purchase/test drive equipment in a small town; and living in Canada doesn't help(small market). And third, the tones i heard via artists or the internet...YES I KNOW overly compressed and all that...weren't that impressive...overly processed to the point of being benign or heard before a thousand times . Anyway, i had an opportunity to purchase a Triple Triple this week and i am totally BLOWN AWAY! That finally leads me to this subject about Tone. I had ZERO, and i mean ZERO problems achieving spectacular results on all channels in very little time without the usual complaints about flubby bass, gets lost in the mix, doesn't cut, buzzy, ect. From Fenderish cleans to Marshall to Mesa tones in no time without the need for EQ's. There is literally a Million tones hiding in that box and with a cheap $30 dollar Bad Monkey in the front end i was n Heaven. It's the first time in a long time iv'e been this excited about an amp...and I've had a ton of them. I will say this; it IS a particularly finicky amp when it comes to Cabs. Luckily i had a few around, including a Mesa traditional, but found my Traynor YCS 412AV2 cab(V30's)was far and away the winner. Tight Lows, great Mids (including Upper)and rounded off Highs...all those Tones and more if i wanted. So, i guess i'll be shelving the Marshall for a while and enjoy exploring some of those Million Tones.

As a Western person, I do most things from right to left. It's something that most people in the U.S. are trained to do practically from birth. With the Rectos, dialing in a sound is about going left to right. Once I began with the gain, treble and mid, I didn't have many problems. The bass and presence are to fill in the sound and should be used as seasoning.

If a person wants a certain tone, an EQ is good to use, but you are correct that it isn't totally necessary.

Agreed...it's a very different beast, in a good way. Slight turns of knobs make huge differences in tone...lots of fun!

 

[cabbageclutcher]

A million tones ...! Agree. The triple is such a beast, even though circuitry wise in the pre-amp section it same with the dual but it really capable , to do more things in term of aggression and brutality in tone. The multi-watt and non multi-watt version both are heavy and brutal as hell, don't need an eq in the loop. I find with a reissue tube screamer 808 35th edition pedal in the front the tone is really superb, beyond the Maxon OD 808.

I have a few OD's around ala SD1, Bad Monkey, 808, ect. I found the SD1 to be too ragged, if that applies. The 808 was good but misses the warmth, if you will, that the Bad Monkey introduced to the signal. Iv'e heard allot of talk about the Seymour D 805 and would be interested in hearing from people about their experiences...or is it just another OD.

 

[totosik]

I also find the same thing with the (reissue) regular 808 and the hw version, missed the warmth, the Maxon 808 can give more definition and clarity to the aggression, i.e. distortion tone. But the 35'th (with narrower casing) is the next level different, it accentuate the warmth and thick, doesn't harsh piercing like the Maxon tend to. Just my perception. Or maybe it slightly different with the regular.

 

[afu]

https://warpedmusician.wordpress.com/2015/09/05/the-fmv-tone-stack-and-dual-rectifier/

The above is how I have already explained the tone stack from my point of view, but now it's edited to make more sense.

 

[Jorn218]

@JamesFarrel - Hey, you never gave some detail on how you have been setting your amp up. How have you been setting your channel's knobs up? I understand the loose lows you are talking about. I called them the Smog Monster tone. They are not inherent to the amp if you are setting them up to how Mesa explains in the manual, or better yet, how Afu-San has explained it in some threads here on the board, or his blog. Once he unveiled this tone shaping kung fu and I applied it to my amp, a whole new amp spoke through the speakers.

This is how I apply his suggestions:
-Start by setting the Channel's volume, voicing, and gain to your liking with all tone knobs off. First bring up the highs to get the attack you are looking for
-Bring up the mids to balance the attack and give shape to the tone(MY added Mod to Afu's method: close your eyes and listen while doing this. You will get it perfect each time)
-Bring up the bass to make her bottom end perfect and tight. You will know when you go too far, back it off slightly if you do.
-use the presence to bring back the treble cut lost while adding the mids and lows.

Before I applied his method of tone shaping, I was always fighting with the bass guitar, or fighting the flubby low end. Now I prefer to not use a gain pedal in the signal path. I have also started using the Solo function instead as it just makes the overall output a little higher, while compressing the tone perfectly when doing solos. Similar to what everyone wants the gain pedal up front for, but this way it sounds so much cleaner and natural.

My method of utilizing the Solo function of the Dual Rectifier:
-Set the Solo so when you activate it via the foot pedal, you get only a slight audible volume increase for a lead/solo, etc.. You are looking to only give it a slight push above the rhythm amplitude level, anything more then it gets out of control fast. (My personal level is usually only about 1/8" +/- where the Output is set totally dependant on the room you're in.