Saw Tool last nite with Diezel amps

[rabies]

show was way better in 1993 undertow tour. maynard is not angry anymore and jokes around too much. no mosh pit (very lame). renditions were good, however, esp. flood (distorted bass throughout!) and stinkfist. very tight and few or no mistakes.

The cleans sucked on the guitar. The drums and bass were the highlights of the show. Good show but not worth the price (the tix I bought for $130 on eBay were actually originally $200/pr in the ORCH right section). Nice venue: LA live Nokia theater.

maynard and/or adam were doing some interesting (floydish?) keyboard stuff.

I couldn't really see if there was any other amps up there or what cabs, just two Diezel heads (or at least one).

 

[screamingdaisy]

Always wondered why Tool fans flip out over Diezel amps. I always thought the Marshal/Recto mix was more important to his sound.

 

[rabies]

well, according to the producer of 10K days album, they used diezel, rivera and marshall/mesa (3 amps total). For flood last nite, i'm pretty sure i heard at least mostly diezel. and possibly mesa cabs but i was too far away to be sure.

That diezel amp has a very pronounced/chunky mids and tight for fast riffs. Sometimes I like that sound and sometimes I like a ball crushing Marshall (like Ministry filth pig or Filter nice shot).

I tried an Einstein once and liked it, but way over-priced. and that model is cheaper than the $4500 herbert/VH4. waaaaaay too much money. you could get a nice marshall *and* mesa for that much money...

 

[stephen sawall]

Adams sound has always been mostly his Marshall. The other amps are only to fill in some of the sound.
I agree the band is lame compared with the early days. .... and I also agree his guitar sound was best with the Mesa/Marshall rig.

 

[b0nkersx]

I saw them a year ago. I thought they were good, but not worth the price of admission.. it was kind of a lame show, honestly. They came in, played their songs, and left.. that was it. No interaction with the crowd whatsoever.

 

[rabies]

They came in, played their songs, and left.. that was it. No interaction with the crowd whatsoever.

i actually prefer that, that's what NIN did on the downward spiral tour...

 

[stephen sawall]

They came in, played their songs, and left.. that was it. No interaction with the crowd whatsoever.

i actually prefer that, that's what NIN did on the downward spiral tour...

Plus one .... No matter how big or small the band is I do not at any time want to hear someone talking into the microphone for any reason ever. Why anyone would think this is a good idea I can not imagine. "Look at me, I have a microphone and you don't"
Is this really entertainment ? ....or just some ego driven behavior with no purpose at all ?

 

[rabies]

They came in, played their songs, and left.. that was it. No interaction with the crowd whatsoever.

i actually prefer that, that's what NIN did on the downward spiral tour...

Plus one .... No matter how big or small the band is I do not at any time want to hear someone talking into the microphone for any reason ever. Why anyone would think this is a good idea I can not imagine. "Look at me, I have a microphone and you don't"
Is this really entertainment ? ....or just some ego driven behavior with no purpose at all ?

yeah, like busta rhymes prior to david bowie a few years ago: "california, can I get some love?"

dismissed. 2 mins between songs is lame as ****.

 

[stephen sawall]

2 minutes .... that is pretty ridicules.

I did see Paul Stanley talk for 10 minutes once well Peter Criss was in the john. He was talking about Peter's eating habits, etc ..... it became a stand-up comedy routine and was very good.

 

[volatileNoise]

Tool have never been "amazing" live, they have very simple elements and quite technical stuff going on rhythm wise, they are very much a studio monster and create "amazing" albums with some awesome sound engineering that makes them stand out, and makes Tool, Tool.

Put it into a live situation and it becomes a different ball game, as the above studio brilliance will never translate in big redneck stadium shows. Amazing music translates in small venues, at real gigs! Not in stadiums, not a gig, just a show.

And as for Diezel, they have been the primary part of the AJ/Tool sound for years now, combined with the Marshall Bass head thing, and probably gets paid by Diezel every time he uses them live.

Enough about Tool, get onto Karnivool...

 

[stephen sawall]

Tool have never been "amazing" live, they have very simple elements and quite technical stuff going on rhythm wise, they are very much a studio monster and create "amazing" albums with some awesome sound engineering that makes them stand out, and makes Tool, Tool.

Put it into a live situation and it becomes a different ball game, as the above studio brilliance will never translate in big redneck stadium shows. Amazing music translates in small venues, at real gigs! Not in stadiums, not a gig, just a show.

And as for Diezel, they have been the primary part of the AJ/Tool sound for years now, combined with the Marshall Bass head thing, and probably gets paid by Diezel every time he uses them live.

Enough about Tool, get onto Karnivool...

Obviously you never saw them on the Ænima and earlier tours.

They built their reputation on live shows. They never got a lot of radio play in most areas. I agree all large shows are kind of lame .... but Tool has done a lot of smaller venues threw-out their carries. Peter Diezel does not pay endorsements, it is just a very small business. Peter told me he does not know Adam.

 

[rabies]

I saw Tool 3 times now. The first was in 1993 in Baltimore, MD @ Hammerjacks where I saw FNM as well. That venue is two levels and holds maybe 2000 ppl. Killer show. Very intense and no trippy bullshit. swarming mosh pit. intimidating for an 18 yr old's first rock concert.

 

[volatileNoise]

Cool, I am sure in the Aenima days would have been the time to see them, but even watching footage on youtube of the older stuff (I have watched a lot) I have to say that Maynard is not a strong live vocalist, a good vocalist yes, but not capable of replicating his studio captured vocal strength in a live situation.

Argue different if you like, but hey I have played alongside and witnessed others that can replicate, and even out-do their studio efforts.

Anyway, Diezel amps... Yep, not that good live either! (and I ain't just talking about Tool) but again, it is all subjective to what is plugged into the **** things!

But just so you all know, the best music that is an evolution of this style, is being produced by Aussie bands.

 

[stephen sawall]

I have seen every tour .... some several times, 20 some shows since the first EP. OGT .... it is hard to describe the energy of the early shows. It had more in common with a Baptist Revival than a concert for any who had been there. You do not really think a Youtube clip is a real way to judge anything ?

All singers and musicians in most cases have a real advantage with many takes in the studio. I feel Maynard is better live now than ever with his singing live. When he started everyone .... including band members said he was awful.

I have seen many struggle with a Diezel live, it disappears in the mix. Some claim this is not a problem for them, but I have yet to see that myself. Personally I feel Adams best sounds were when he was using Mesa and Marshall. I have played on Diezel amps and have no problem saying they are great ..... I like the Herbert myself best.

What bands do you recommend from Aussie volatileNoise ?

 

[volatileNoise]

Hey yeah I totally agree man... Diezel does get lost in the mix more in my opinion too.

Australian bands... Ok you may have heard a couple of these names, but check this lot out.

http://www.myspace.com/karnivool
http://www.myspace.com/cogrockmusic
http://www.myspace.com/quietchildtheband
http://www.myspace.com/deadlettercircus
http://www.myspace.com/jericcoband
http://www.myspace.com/twelvefootninja
http://www.myspace.com/volytion
http://www.myspace.com/sleepparade
http://www.myspace.com/amirala
http://www.myspace.com/thesideshowband

bit of a mixed bag there, being at various levels and stages of their journey, but **** near all deliver a very solid live set.

oh, and I am not necessarily a fan of all of these either... but they do deserve credit for their music.

 

[b0nkersx]

i actually prefer that, that's what NIN did on the downward spiral tour...

There was really no reason to go see them, though. I felt like I was paying $90 to listen to album songs that I paid $10 for. It's one thing to make yourself look like a moron on stage. It's another thing to have some kind of stage presence/energy.

They literally just drudged up, hammered out their most popular songs with minimal changes for about an hour and a half, and then walked off. I would have been better off staying at home and listening to the studio albums :/

 

[volatileNoise]

i actually prefer that, that's what NIN did on the downward spiral tour...

There was really no reason to go see them, though. I felt like I was paying $90 to listen to album songs that I paid $10 for. It's one thing to make yourself look like a moron on stage. It's another thing to have some kind of stage presence/energy.

They literally just drudged up, hammered out their most popular songs with minimal changes for about an hour and a half, and then walked off. I would have been better off staying at home and listening to the studio albums :/

Tool is not everyone's cup of tea, that is for sure, and the people that like them just for what they consider to be a mosh pit element because there is some heavy riffage going on, are probably not getting what they are about anyway, and if you want crowd interaction and some sort of small talk between songs, then maybe neither are you.

Tool are a very emotive band, but if you don't "feel" it, then you are probably better off going to a Metallica "show" for more the stadium monster experience.
At least that is what I would do, but then again I don't understand people that listen to **** they can't relate to in some way or form anyway, but hey that is what the mainstream is for, people that don't really connect with music as such, they just use it for background noise, meaningless or whatever.

 

[b0nkersx]

Tool is not everyone's cup of tea, that is for sure, and the people that like them just for what they consider to be a mosh pit element because there is some heavy riffage going on, are probably not getting what they are about anyway, and if you want crowd interaction and some sort of small talk between songs, then maybe neither are you.

Tool are a very emotive band, but if you don't "feel" it, then you are probably better off going to a Metallica "show" for more the stadium monster experience.
At least that is what I would do, but then again I don't understand people that listen to sh!t they can't relate to in some way or form anyway, but hey that is what the mainstream is for, people that don't really connect with music as such, they just use it for background noise, meaningless or whatever.

I wasn't looking for a mosh pit. I've listened to Tool for years, and I know what they're "about". I *was*, however, looking for something more than perfect recreations of songs I've heard over 100 times each. There are plenty of older Tool concerts with plenty of interaction from Maynard, or improv/something different from the band itself. They didn't seem really "into it" this tour.

On another note, I thought Adam's live tone was good, but not GREAT.

 

[stephen sawall]

Hey yeah I totally agree man... Diezel does get lost in the mix more in my opinion too.

Australian bands... Ok you may have heard a couple of these names, but check this lot out.

http://www.myspace.com/karnivool
http://www.myspace.com/cogrockmusic
http://www.myspace.com/quietchildtheband
http://www.myspace.com/deadlettercircus
http://www.myspace.com/jericcoband
http://www.myspace.com/twelvefootninja
http://www.myspace.com/volytion
http://www.myspace.com/sleepparade
http://www.myspace.com/amirala
http://www.myspace.com/thesideshowband

bit of a mixed bag there, being at various levels and stages of their journey, but **** near all deliver a very solid live set.

oh, and I am not necessarily a fan of all of these either... but they do deserve credit for their music.

Thanks .... glad I asked. I am checking out a few of the clips now. I see karnivool is playing here in a few weeks .... I may go down and check them out.

 

[volatileNoise]

Thanks .... glad I asked. I am checking out a few of the clips now. I see karnivool is playing here in a few weeks .... I may go down and check them out.

yeah I would highly recommend seeing them, their live set these days is exceptional, and the new album "sound awake" has become what I would consider essential listening. Their longer tracks I consider to be one up on Tools lengthy stuff.