Roadster Shred settings - please help!

[mark_quench]

Hi there, I'm new to this board and this is my first post. Just wanted some help with getting a shred sound on my Roadster.

I'm a recent convert to Boogie from Marshall and I LOVE my new Roadster, but the only thing I'm struggling to get is a good high gain sound for palm muted single note riffs e.g. Petrucci, Metallica, KSE etc. I'm using channel 4, Modern. If I turn the gain up, it goes too fizzy, but when the gain is lower, although chords sound HUGE, the single note stuff lacks some sizzle e.g. hard rock crunch rather than metal shred. The only way I can describe it is that it sounds like a 'thunk' rather than a 'zzzzhug' - anyone know what I mean? How can I get that sizzle back without the fizz?! e.g. Intro to "Kill The King" by Megadeth (not a great tone, but was the first example I could think of!!))

Now I can get the sound I'm after when I add a TubeScreamer before the amp, but I really want to get this sound without pedals. I used to get the sound from my Marshall so why can't I get it from the far superior Mesa? If Channel 4 Modern can't get heavy enough, there's no hope left!

Any ideas or sample settings would be most appreciated. As I said, I love all other aspects of the amp, but I'm missing something in the metal dept, which seems crazy!

Many thanks,

Mark

 

[Spewnz]

that sound your after is in the upper mid-range that marshalls have a ton more of than a recto. try el34s a lot of guys swear by those for the roadster. also try an eq and boost your mids.

 

[screamingdaisy]

Dime the midrange with the treble and presence zeroed. Add bass to taste. If the results are too dark, increase the presence for more top end (leave the treble on zero).

 

[YellowJacket]

Hi there, I'm new to this board and this is my first post. Just wanted some help with getting a shred sound on my Roadster.

I'm a recent convert to Boogie from Marshall and I LOVE my new Roadster, but the only thing I'm struggling to get is a good high gain sound for palm muted single note riffs e.g. Petrucci, Metallica, KSE etc. I'm using channel 4, Modern. If I turn the gain up, it goes too fizzy, but when the gain is lower, although chords sound HUGE, the single note stuff lacks some sizzle e.g. hard rock crunch rather than metal shred. The only way I can describe it is that it sounds like a 'thunk' rather than a 'zzzzhug' - anyone know what I mean? How can I get that sizzle back without the fizz?! e.g. Intro to "Kill The King" by Megadeth (not a great tone, but was the first example I could think of!!))

Now I can get the sound I'm after when I add a TubeScreamer before the amp, but I really want to get this sound without pedals. I used to get the sound from my Marshall so why can't I get it from the far superior Mesa? If Channel 4 Modern can't get heavy enough, there's no hope left!

Any ideas or sample settings would be most appreciated. As I said, I love all other aspects of the amp, but I'm missing something in the metal dept, which seems crazy!

Many thanks,

Mark

Well, boogies are better built but I wouldn't necessarily say they are 'superior' in tone to a Marshall, just different. Tone is all in the ear of the beholder so if you want the sound of a marshall, get that. Maybe if you dig a Mesa, you actually are gassing after a Mark series amp (Like the Mark V) instead of a Roadster. Just a thought.

That being said, what sort of guitar are you using? What pickups does it have in it? Hotter pickups that emphasize the frequencies you want will really go well with a recto. My friend has one of the Dimebag Darryl pups in his Jackson and he gets great metal tones even without extreme settings. I mean you have to find what works for you. A boost or using an eq also will work and if it sounds good, who cares? Additionally, Mills Acoustics builds oversized 4 x 12s that -in addition to great rock tones- are tailor made for TEH BROOTALZ. They are made with a ported partial baffle in the center to break up standing waves. The result is that there are no flubby bottom of the boat frequences that are so typical of the Standard Rectocabs. Also consider speakers. New Celestion v30s can sound really fizzy and they need to be broken in a bit. There are many great celestion speakers and in addition to this, many other companies also make great sounding guitar speakers. Some people here favour a mix of Celestion v30s and G12K 100s in an X pattern for metal If the speakers aren't a problem, putting a high quality quartet of EL34 tubes (valves) can greatly enhance the detail and midrange bark of the crunch tone. You can also custom pick your preamp tubes to tailor your sound and if all this is too much work, you can get your amp modded to sound more the way YOU want it to sound.
I guess there are a great number of ways to customize your tone if you are almost there already, so if you are that close, you simply have to find what you are looking for. Of course my post is slightly tongue in cheek because I realize that oftentimes, dissatisfaction is a sign that you have the wrong amp for you. Just because people say something is good, doesn't mean it is the right tool for you. If you look up the Recto series amps online you'll see that the complaints you are mentioning are very common, especially among metal players. Rectos are really much more tailored to being grunge / saggy nu metal amps rather than tight metal amps. Of course you can work around this with the right settings, tube combinations, speaker enclosures / speaker types, guitars and pups; but do you really want to be fighting with the amp? Really, many people buy Mesa because of the name and reputation, and they are super frustrated when their 'super amp' isn't capable of what they want. As a result, many people end up selling them later. In other scenarios, as players grow and their needs change, sometimes they find they outgrow their gear and need to trade up.

I know I'm throwing the kitchen sink around but I hope this helps.

 

[mark_quench]

Hey guys, there's some great wisdom in there. I'll try those things out with different guitars (I've got a Gibson Les Paul Std, Fender Strat Plus with Hot Rails and an Ibanez RG series). Hopefully with a bit of EQ and maybe trying EL34s I might find that illusive shred sound. Any other comments or suggestions will be gratefully received - especially if you also own a Roadster and want to suggest the settings for channel 4! Thanks again people.

 

[mrd]

One thing to keep in mind when you're dialing your amp is the volume... All those guys you've listed probably record with their amps at ear-splitting volumes to bring out the sweetness of the power section. I can easily get great 'zzzchngt!' sounds if my Road King (I know it's not a Roadster but it is pretty darn similar) is turned right up. Also, I know that, overall, Petrucci uses the Mark series more-so than the Recto series. I'm pretty sure he used to use MKIIC+ back in the day, as well as a MKIV and now he uses a dual MKV setup. For Train of Thought he used a Road King, so if any tones you are seeking are on that album, they should definitely be attainable with your Roadster. But again, keep in mind... he probably had his amp dimed. As for Metallica, all their old school tones are MKIIC+'s slaved through Marshalls which basically equates to Mark series amps with EL34s in the power section, which has already been mentioned. EL34s have a bit less low end (vs. 6L6s), and a more prominent mid-range and high-end. Being that guitar is a mid-range instrument, it makes sense that EL34s bring out the inherent bark of a guitar when they are pushed hard.

Anyway, all the mumbo jumbo aside, if you aren't able to crank your Roadster to at least 12 o'clock noon on the volume knob (which is really the only way you'll ever begin to know what a Recto sounds like), there are some tricks to do. First off, read the manual, like... 50 times. If the Roadster manual is anything like my Road King manual, it's a gold mine. Remember that treble is the most powerful knob on the amp, and that the more you dial, the less the mid and bass knobs will affect the tone. Furthermore, presence is another extremely powerful global tone knob. It affects frequencies that are higher than the treble knob. It allows you to dial in the bite. Careful though, this knob is extremely sensitive. On my Road King, even turning it a few degrees can make or break a tone. Get right down in front of your cab (make sure you have ear plugs in, or turn it down) and do a simple low-E chug while you twist the presence knob to hear how it works. The higher you go, you should be able to really hear your pick scraping across the strings and give the tone a very defined and sharp attack. If you go too high, it just turns into ice picks, go too low and you lose definition in chords. Low presence settings actually work surprisingly well for single-note solo sounds, btw. On the Road King, each mode and each channel all have a different range of presence that is considered "good", so I would expect the same to be true on the Roadster.

Also, another thing to consider is playing style. The harder you hit the strings, the more upper-level harmonics will become apparent in the signal, and this makes it easier for the amp to overdrive. Take this comparison... if you're on the clean channel and you smack a chord super hard, you just get a really loud, clear tone that peaks quickly then fades away. Your ears will probably also be bleeding, but that's another issue. Switch to CH4 and do the same thing... notice how the huge peak and "bark" is gone? The gain compresses everything down, so when you hit hard, instead of getting a volume peak, you merely introduce more high-level harmonics into the sound. Typically, metal players play quite hard. I know for myself, when I play metal, I play almost to the point of bringing the strings out of tune from hitting them. As Petrucci says: "Dig in and chunk out!"

Settings? Try these for CH4 modern with your Les Paul

Volume: Noon
Presence: 9-11o'clock (it's been a while since I've had my recto up this loud so I might be a bit off here)
Bass: 8 or 9 o'clock (when the amp is this loud, the cab itself lends enough low end from resonance that adding too much with the actual amp EQ itself can spell disaster)
Mids: 10-2 o'clock (same thing here as with bass, too much can muddy up your signal, but a good mix gives you a nice cut)
Treble: Noon
Gain: Noon

Hope it helps!

 

[mark_quench]

Hey mrd, great advice/observations etc and great settings for channel 4. I tried them at a rehearsal on Thursday and they sounded good. Still need a Tube Screamer for that real KSE shred, but hey, I'm happy with that.

 

[mrd]

I used to use an MXR 10-band EQ out front of my MKIV and RK to cut bass frequencies a bit and hit the front end harder. Les Pauls are pretty bass heavy so it doesn't hurt to cut some of the low frequencies out to tighten it up. It worked pretty well but I don't do that anymore. Tone is all in the fingers! :mrgreen:

When you play louder and the power tubes actually start to compress your sound down, the natural "bassiness" of a Les Paul should be less of an issue because the compression of the power tubes is causing higher level frequencies to become more apparent and create a more balanced sound. I would almost say that if you're playing quite loud, you shouldn't need an EQ pedal, at least for a HPF.

Also, try turning up the gain and mids a bit more from my suggested settings. You could probably get a bit more juice out of them before it starts sounding like mush at that volume. Also, like was mentioned before... you could turn the bass knob off and dime the mids but be careful here because if you're playing really loudly, this can create kind of an overbearing tone. Adjust your gain back a bit if you try this one... it works well though.

 

[mrd]

Also, if you're ballsy, try diming the volume. If you're gunna do this, I suggest doing it when your band mates aren't there and use some good quality ear plugs. Turn the gain to zero, volume right up, and start playing as you slowly raise the gain up. By the time the gain is at about 9 o'clock, your pants should be rattling quite nicely. I know it's pretty extreme but if you have a space to try it, try it. See how far you can push the gain before it turns into mush. Some great tones hiding in there!

 

[KH Guitar Freak]

For a smoother solo sound, channel 3 has a smoother high end in general over channel 4...

 

[jbird]

I was gonna say...Try channel 3 in modern @ 50 watts, cranked!