MkIIC: '+' or not '+'? Mystery solved

[GeoBull]

If you read my previous thread on Mk IIC I have this amp [1]. I'm the original owner and have been very happy with the amp for 22 years. I spent a bunch of time on the phone with Mike B at Mesa today and here's what I learned:

-My amp is NOT a '+'
--Mike B. suggested the effects return test [2]
--He felt this was a definitive test
--I did the test and <sniff> my amp is not a '+'
-Mike suggested the mod strongly
--$300 w/o Reverb and EQ
--$50 more if reverb; $50 more if EQ
--I have both so my mods will be $400
--Plan on another $100 to $150 for shipping and other stuff they might find
-As has been discussed he pointed out that a mod to Simul would change the character because they no longer make the output transformer that was originally used; I could find e.g. a MkIII, steal the output tranny from that and make my Mk IIC a Simul but for collectibility he suggested leaving it as 60/100.

I'm going to do the '+' mod. It seems a no brainer and to have the guy who worked on the amp originally give the once-over-twice as well as mod it seems totally worthwhile.

I'm going to skip the Simul mod; given my style and my Parker Fly (bright guitar) a Simul might be better but not worth modding this one.

I took my amp to a jam session this weekend; before I played a bunch of other guys played through it; without fail each came up to me and said 'Man, that is the BEST amp I've ever played through'. Go Boogie!

Thanks to everybody on the board for help with this.

And meanwhile, still thinking about a Mk IV

[1]
Serial number 12275 (which I believe makes it NOT a '+' series)
-Features
--60/100
--Reverb
--EQ
--Celestion Blackshadow (just put it in; Electrovoice 1x12 was the original)

[2]
1) Plug your guitar into the Effects Return jack (back of amp)
2) Switch to lead mode
3) Turn the Lead Drive and Gain controls
4) If they have NO effect on the volume and sound you have a '+'

 

[mesanomad100]

ahhhh what a sad story,but It does show that even if the '+' series are more sought after you and many of your friends(and other guitarists) belive that that amp is the best sounding amp out there,does it matter if it has the MikeB + above the power cable????/

If it aint broken dont fix it ie If it sounds great the now dont mess with it,buy another MKIIc then mod that one to c+ status,keep what you have if ya like it,If not sell it to me,or trade ya it for a microwave hehe

Euan

 

[visualrocker69]

Out of curiosity... how much DOES this mod cost, and why did you decide to omit it? Just "collectibility"?

Would you use a blue stripe MKIII? That has the closest power section to the IIC+, right? I've seen a few go for 800 or less on ebay.

 

[MaxBoogie]

Nice to hear from another 60/100 owner! I own 2 MkIII Simuls, and 1 60/100, and I love them each for different reasons, but the 60/100 really kicks some butt! It has a fabulous tone that the other two don't seem to have... all very subtle mind you, but my Boogie-ears do hear a difference.

 

[GeoBull]

Out of curiosity... how much DOES this mod cost, and why did you decide to omit it? Just "collectibility"?

Would you use a blue stripe MKIII? That has the closest power section to the IIC+, right? I've seen a few go for 800 or less on ebay.

I didn't get a price on the Simul mod (the '+' mod is $400). I'm deciding to skip it because it wouldn't bring the amp to Mk IIC+ Simul spec so, yes, I guess partly for collectibility. But also because I like the 60/100 sound enough that if I want to go for a modern tranny simul sound perhaps I'll buy a Mk IV.

That's another possibility; the mk III

 

[visualrocker69]

I'm deciding to skip it because it wouldn't bring the amp to Mk IIC+ Simul spec so, yes, I guess partly for collectibility. But also because I like the 60/100 sound enough that if I want to go for a modern tranny simul sound perhaps I'll buy a Mk IV.

That's another possibility; the mk III

Hold on... a bit confused. A simul-class mod WOULDN'T bring the amp to IIC+ Simul specifications? Why not?

Is it because they no longer make the transformer? But if I took one from a Mark III, is it identical? Once again, which stripe MKIII should I use if I do so? Would THAT bring the specifications to MKIIC+ simul-class?

Also, one more thing, 60/100 means you can switch between 60 and 100 watt operation? Whereas Simul-class is what...85/15? I was never too sure...

Thanks

 

[GeoBull]

I'm deciding to skip it because it wouldn't bring the amp to Mk IIC+ Simul spec so, yes, I guess partly for collectibility. But also because I like the 60/100 sound enough that if I want to go for a modern tranny simul sound perhaps I'll buy a Mk IV.

That's another possibility; the mk III

Hold on... a bit confused. A simul-class mod WOULDN'T bring the amp to IIC+ Simul specifications? Why not?

Is it because they no longer make the transformer? But if I took one from a Mark III, is it identical? Once again, which stripe MKIII should I use if I do so? Would THAT bring the specifications to MKIIC+ simul-class?

Also, one more thing, 60/100 means you can switch between 60 and 100 watt operation? Whereas Simul-class is what...85/15? I was never too sure...

Thanks

Good questions: There are two mods: '+' and 'Simul'.

-The '+' mod will change a Mk IIC to be a Mk IIC+.
-There was a time when the Simul mod would have changed a Mk IIC (+ or otherwise) from a 60/100 (see below) to a Simul-class.
-The Mk IIC Simul-class used (I think) a different output transformer than the 60/100. This output transformer is no longer made. Therefore, having the Simul mod done now would require using a different transformer than the original Mk IIC Simul and would therefore not bring it to Mk IIC Simul spec.
-If you found an output transformer the same as the one's used in Mk IIC days and sent it to Boogie or had someone do the mod I imagine you would have, in affect, a Mk IIC Simul.

The 60/100 switch indeed switches between 60 RMS and 100 RMS. I believe 60 runs just the two outside tubes and the 100 runs all four. The Siuml is 85/15 (although I think a VERY loud 15). There is an article on the MESA website about Simul I think.

 

[visualrocker69]

Thanks a lot :-D

 

[Whammyless]

If you read my previous thread on Mk IIC I have this amp [1]. I'm the original owner and have been very happy with the amp for 22 years. I spent a bunch of time on the phone with Mike B at Mesa today and here's what I learned:

-My amp is NOT a '+'
--Mike B. suggested the effects return test [2]
--He felt this was a definitive test
--I did the test and <sniff> my amp is not a '+'
-Mike suggested the mod strongly
--$300 w/o Reverb and EQ
--$50 more if reverb; $50 more if EQ
--I have both so my mods will be $400
--Plan on another $100 to $150 for shipping and other stuff they might find
-As has been discussed he pointed out that a mod to Simul would change the character because they no longer make the output transformer that was originally used; I could find e.g. a MkIII, steal the output tranny from that and make my Mk IIC a Simul but for collectibility he suggested leaving it as 60/100.

I'm going to do the '+' mod. It seems a no brainer and to have the guy who worked on the amp originally give the once-over-twice as well as mod it seems totally worthwhile.

I'm going to skip the Simul mod; given my style and my Parker Fly (bright guitar) a Simul might be better but not worth modding this one.

I took my amp to a jam session this weekend; before I played a bunch of other guys played through it; without fail each came up to me and said 'Man, that is the BEST amp I've ever played through'. Go Boogie!

Thanks to everybody on the board for help with this.

And meanwhile, still thinking about a Mk IV

[1]
Serial number 12275 (which I believe makes it NOT a '+' series)
-Features
--60/100
--Reverb
--EQ
--Celestion Blackshadow (just put it in; Electrovoice 1x12 was the original)

[2]
1) Plug your guitar into the Effects Return jack (back of amp)
2) Switch to lead mode
3) Turn the Lead Drive and Gain controls
4) If they have NO effect on the volume and sound you have a '+'

-I've got 3 IIC+'s: a coliseum with graphic, 60/100 watt with graphic and reverb, and a loaded Simul. IMHO, you don't need the SimulClass. I know others will disagree with me but all three of mine pretty much sound the same. They have the same flavor and I actually prefer my 60/100 loaded with all 6L6's vs my Simul with 6L6/EL34. The Coliseum is an absolute beast and I'd play that one more if it wasn't so expensive to retube with 6 power tubes and all.

My Simul IIC+ was modded a few months ago by Mike B from a IIC, one of the cleanest he'd ever seen. I wish I made clips as there's a huge difference between IIC and IIC+; a lot more gain and punch. The IIC does sound good but the IIC+ is much, much better! The only I other "mod" I would recommend for you is to move the chassis to a headshell. Never did like the Mesa combos. I've got custom headshells by Kerry Wright for mine and they kick serious *** with a basic Avatar cab. I'll have a custom cab made soon but the external 2x12 cab made a huge difference vs the combos.

As far as the Mark IV goes, nice amp but I don't miss mine all that much. If I found another at a good price, I'd probably pick one up. I had an "A" and I feel the IIC+ is a much more responsive amp vs the IV but it's more "vintage-y" sounding. IIC+ can get heavy but I think the IV is voiced "heavier". R2 on the IV sux big time for me. What's totally cool, though is Mark III, IIC/IIC+, IV; can't go wrong with any of them. I could see myself getting another III or IV just for the hell of it if the price is right.

So, to recap, get the "+" mod but not the Simul mod. Try an external cab. Enjoy!!!

 

[igfraso]

Mike Bendinelli told me that, if you run your amp at 100 watt and plug the speaker on the 4 ohm jack, it will sound quite similar to a Simul-Class.