Mesa / Doug West Interview

[rarebitusa]

For some reason this one has flown under the wire. So much of what Doug said resonated with me... supply chain issues, the transformer deal, EU compliance, etc. Anyway it touches on many points, covers a bit of the history much of that is the std talking points, but there's interesting tidbits that were new to me. Long but worthwhile IMHO.



Mesa/Boogie Are Back! | The Relaunch, Gibson & The Secret Mark VI!

 

[domct203]

Thanks for sharing!

Dom

 

[sloanthebone]

The one and only Mark VI from that video, 26:00 in:

 

[rarebitusa]

Sure looks like a VII with just a VI logo wonder if it really was much different.

 

[bandit2013]

Trying to gauge the size of the transformers. They look much smaller in the captured image than the actual mark VII amp. Wonder what those settings on the amp will sound like? Someone likes to run a rich reverb.

 

[Dude52]

Thanks for sharing !

 

[Snicksound]

Sounds like Doug almost slipped and revealed an upcoming amp that includes the CabClone IR. He said it was on 3 amps and was about to name something until the other guy stopped him.

Looks like he was about to say "Triple"

Now, I do believe the Triple Crown deserves the full CabClone IR treatment for how much it sells for, but I doubt that would be the priority.

So that leaves me with two possibilities
- A Triple Crown 25
- An updated Triple Rectifier

They don't usually cram 3 channels into 25W amps, and without the 3 channels can you really call it a "Triple" Crown?

The Dual/Triple Rec are definitely in need of an updated, one that includes a CabClone IR (and hopefully a smaller chassis so it fits atop a vertical 212), but he said 3 amps (Badlander and MKVII already have it) and was about to say "Triple"-something. I really do hope they don't update only the Triple Rectifier. With the cost of tubes and the average stage volume these days, just the Dual will do please.

Or he was simply about to say Triple Crown cause he was confused with the non-IR CabClone... But let me dream

 

[Snicksound]

Something else interesting, Doug mentioned they removed the Master/Solo circuit from the MKVII because they found that was required to get the real IIC+ tone, that it sounded more direct.

Now that's interesting... See, I love the Badlander because it doesn't feel as compressed as other Mesa amps I've owned in the past, it does give that "guitar connected straight to the speaker" feeling in terms of immediacy and transparency.

You know what other amp did that? The Mark IV (does have a global Master though, but no Solo)

But when I played through a Mark V, that feeling was lost. Sounded a bit more compressed and separated. The Triple Crown gave me that feeling too.
The Mark V 25 does not have that circuit, but I didn't spend enough time with it to judge.

I was kinda dissapointed the Badlander didn't have this, but now that I think about it, based on my experience and what Doug is saying, maybe the lack of a global Master and Solo is at least partially responsible for me enjoying the BAD a lot more than the usual Rectos or the Mark V

So I guess I need to try the MKVII now. If it can have the immediacy of my old Mark IV, I might be interested

 

[FedWar]

Nah man, they removed it simply because there was not enough space for it on the faceplate.
And imho this is a big issue since you cannot turn everything down without messing with the channels' level
Mark iv had a global master volume and each channel had a channel volume.
solo volume means to switch to a master global 2.
Mark ii, including the iic+ and iii had global master and lead master channel volume, clean went directly o master volume on these.
So no, imho it is only smoke and mirrors to justify the fact that they did not have any space left for those, as for the jp2c due to the fact the they chose a small head chassis.

Something else interesting, Doug mentioned they removed the Master/Solo circuit from the MKVII because they found that was required to get the real IIC+ tone, that it sounded more direct.

Now that's interesting... See, I love the Badlander because it doesn't feel as compressed as other Mesa amps I've owned in the past, it does give that "guitar connected straight to the speaker" feeling in terms of immediacy and transparency.

You know what other amp did that? The Mark IV (does have a global Master though, but no Solo)

But when I played through a Mark V, that feeling was lost. Sounded a bit more compressed and separated. The Triple Crown gave me that feeling too.
The Mark V 25 does not have that circuit, but I didn't spend enough time with it to judge.

I was kinda dissapointed the Badlander didn't have this, but now that I think about it, based on my experience and what Doug is saying, maybe the lack of a global Master and Solo is at least partially responsible for me enjoying the BAD a lot more than the usual Rectos or the Mark V

So I guess I need to try the MKVII now. If it can have the immediacy of my old Mark IV, I might be interested

 

[Snicksound]

Nah man, they removed it simply because there was not enough space for it on the faceplate.
And imho this is a big issue since you cannot turn everything down without meaning the levels.
Mark iv had a global master volume and each channel had a channel volume.
solo volume means to switch to a master global 2.
Mark ii, including the iic+ and iii had global master and lead master channel volume, clean went directly o master volume on these.
So no, imho it is only smoke and mirrors to justify the fact that they did not have any space left for those, as for the jp2c due to the fact the they chose a small head chassis.

Sure, it's possible. And yeah I corrected myself, the Mark IV does have a global Master

But the Badlander does have the panel space for the Master/Solo thing. It's missing it and it so happens that it has that immediacy that the Mark IV had that I was never able to get from the Mark V or one of the Recto variants with Master and Solo.

Could also be just coincidence, but found that bit of the interview interesting

 

[rarebitusa]

See, I love the Badlander because it doesn't feel as compressed as other Mesa amps I've owned in the past, it does give that "guitar connected straight to the speaker" feeling in terms of immediacy and transparency.

+1 yea I find the Badlander certainly less compressed then the V:90. It has an organic sound with less midrange honk then the Marks typically have. Now I do dig my V:90, alot... the BAD is just a different beast. I do have an issue these days deciding which one to plug into.

I was kinda dissapointed the Badlander didn't have this, but now that I think about it, based on my experience and what Doug is saying, maybe the lack of a global Master and Solo is at least partially responsible for me enjoying the BAD a lot more than the usual Rectos or the Mark V

I may be wrong but wasn't the TC the last Mesa design to actually have a global Master? Pretty much every design since 2016 has not included it with the TC being the exception. I do find it adds a degree of compression vs running an amp without it, but it's a nice feature to have.

 

[Snicksound]

+1 yea I find the Badlander certainly less compressed then the V:90. It has an organic sound with less midrange honk then the Marks typically have. Now I do dig my V:90, alot... the BAD is just a different beast. I do have an issue these days deciding which one to plug into.

I may be wrong but wasn't the TC the last Mesa design to actually have a global Master? Pretty much every design since 2016 has not included it with the TC being the exception. I do find it adds a degree of compression vs running an amp without it, but it's a nice feature to have.

I did own a TC50 last year, it did have Master and Solo, and it did lack the immediacy of the Badlander (and Mark IV).

Very curious about trying a Mark VII now. The V was a big disappointment to me with how much I enjoyed the IV. I love when I hear others play one, but never connected with it myself.

 

[rarebitusa]

The V was a big disappointment to me with how much I enjoyed the IV. I love when I hear others play one, but never connected with it myself.

Yea the V is certainly a different animal. TBH I've experienced many of the common complaints, overly compressed, Ch 3 harshness, fx loop tonesuck, varying tone from session to session, IIC+ mode isn't really IIC+, jack of all tones and master of none etc. Fortunately I've been able to either dial in a solution directly or come up with a workaround. Mostly with the help of input here on the forum. It's been my #1 for live work. It certainly wasn't a straightforward journey but I totally can understand why one wouldn't connect with it.

I did own a TC50 last year,

For you, how do the TC and the BAD compare?

 

[Snicksound]

For you, how do the TC and the BAD compare?

As far as I'm concerned, the BAD delivers what the TC promised, the most authentic "british" inspired tones from a Mesa so far.

The TC's dirty channels were either muddy or thin depending on if the tight mode was enabled. I mostly remained on channel 2, with Tight disabled, and used an OD pedal when I needed more gain.

The TC had the better cleans though, especially with the onboard reverb. But I don't do clean, I ljke a crunchy clean and the BAD delivers in spade.

The TC did have the advantage of 3 channels, reverb, Solo boost and MIDI, but the resistive load based CabClone was a novelty at best. The BAD is a much simpler beast, but it just sounds amazing out of the box, and the built in CabClone IR is icing on the cake (already have a Captor X so didn't NEED it).

 

[rarebitusa]

The BAD is a much simpler beast, but it just sounds amazing out of the box, and the built in CabClone IR is icing on the cake

Yea, you summed it up well. My thoughts and takes are very similar, I do prefer a denser clean ala the LSS or V's chan 1 Fat a bit more, but the BAD does have that cool sizzly clean. I went with the BAD over the TC and have not looked back.

Also find the integrated CC IR really useful, I'll sometimes use a different preamp into the BAD power stage and silent record with it. It's far less messy then my basic Captor with the WOS.

I was a bit surprised to hear Doug mention the BAD has not had the market response cause it delivers on so many points.

 

[Snicksound]

Yea, you summed it up well. My thoughts and takes are very similar, I do prefer a denser clean ala the LSS or V's chan 1 Fat a bit more, but the BAD does have that cool sizzly clean. I went with the BAD over the TC and have not looked back.

Also find the integrated CC IR really useful, I'll sometimes use a different preamp into the BAD power stage and silent record with it. It's far less messy then my basic Captor with the WOS.

I was a bit surprised to hear Doug mention the BAD has not had the market response cause it delivers on so many points.

I think Mesa might have shot themselves in the foot by calling the BAD a Rectifier. It sounds nothing like a Dual Rec. In fact, after some analysing, it looks like it might be closer to a Mark series amp in terms of how it overdrives.

Maybe they thought it would sell better by placing in a more familiar series, but it's giving people false expectations.