Mercury or Mesa original transformer (new question), help

[pataklp]

I've seen previous topic, but I opened a new one. I want to ask you next thing. I bought a new dual recto over here, and taking it to Europe, and I removed this original transformer right now to sell it, I want to put one in that works on 240V (Europe system).
What you think is better? To buy new one direct from mesa? It would cost me around 300 buck, with shipping included in that price, or to buy a Mercury Magnetics one? I've seen they are about 250 dollars, too, but I found some store, in DFW, TX, that sells mercury transformers for like 150 bucks.
Is there any hearable difference in tone at all, and overall what do you think is better solution, if they were, let say, the same price?
Because many people say, it's better with mesa's original, because it's made to work with that, others say it is all the same.... :?: :wink:

 

[BostonRedSox]

I don't have any experience with the Mercury Magnetics stuff, but what about the Mesa transformer do you not like? It's important to understand, logically, what you hope to achieve by contemplating such a change? Why wouldn't you just order the part from Mesa?

The internet is a helpful tool, but it also can be a very good hype machine as well. Aside from what other people have written, what do YOU think about your sound? What is lacking? More importantly, what is it about the Mercury Magnetics transformers that leave you contemplating a change? If you just want "the best," what do you know specifically that would suggest Mesa hasn't already supplied their amps with these types of transformers?

 

[pataklp]

There is nothing I don't like with my sound, it's perfect, I just have to change it, because I am going over there, so I am asking overall, what is better solution, because I heard lot of stories about those mercury transformers, but never tried one with that. And maybe I could find it cheaper than to order one from mesa, so ask from people general opinion, cause I have no experience with that. Is it going to affect my sound a lot, in whatever direction, if I get a mercury one, or bottom line, it's the same shi! as mesa one.

 

[BostonRedSox]

I think you answered your own question then -- stick with the Mesa Euro-friendly transformer. According to what you've written, you like your sound and only have to switch the transformer because of your living circumstances. Why fix what isn't broken then? I would suggest being content with what you have and only changing what must be changed. Mesa's are great amps stock, with very little changes necessary.

If you go to FJA's website, a company that mods current amps, even they say that people shouldn't mod their amps unless they know what they want specifically. Here is honest information from a company who makes a living off of modding people's amps:

Why mod?
Exactly, why mod? If you don't know why you wanna mod your amp I can't help you very much. I get phone calls and emails ALL the time from people that have a new amp headed their way and want to know what mods I have available for it. If you haven't played the amp how do you know you need a mod? Maybe you don't. Don't fall for all the ******** and hype online created by other shops that just wanna steal your money. I'm all for making money but I only want your money of I can give you something that will work for you and your needs. Not every player has the same needs so just because some guy on a forum said his XYZ amp sounds amazing with mod PDQ doesn't mean it will make you happy.

Play your amp!
Get off the damn internet and play it! All the mods in the world won't make you a better player. If you can't play like Slash, Eddie, George, Vai, Zakk, Yngwie, etc. then my mods won't make you sound any closer to your hero's tone. Spend your time playing and learning how to play better.

One piece of the pie
An amp is just one piece of the pie that makes up your tone. The speakers, speaker cabinet, guitar, strings, pickups, the room, and most of all your fingers all play a part in the end result of what you hear come out of an amp. Anyone of those things could be the weak link in getting what you want to hear from an amp. I can't fix any of those things which are all beyond my control in performing an amp mod.

Don't believe what you read!
Again, get off the damn internet and play it! There is sooooo much ******** information online, in forums, and in magazines about amps and gear it will make your head spin. ANYTHING you read is someone elses opinion, this crap I write included. What one person likes or the way one person perceives the tone of an amp, pedal, guitar, or speaker doesn't mean you will have the same results. Use your head and more importantly your ears to do your own research to find what YOU need. Most of the popular stuff you see is popular because of marketing, not because it was the best. A lot of fancy pictures and name dropping doesn't equal better or the best. Biggest mod shop in the USA? Says who and by what standard? Most unhappy customers? Most come backs? Biggest lies? Square footage? More marketing ********.

This is good advice to live by, and will save you lots of money in the long run. GAS is something that a lot of players on the 'net seem to suffer from. People spend ridiculous amounts of money selling amps for less than what they spent, buying new amps, repeating the process, modding amps, etc. I am just trying to be a friendly voice of reason -- nothing more, nothing less.

 

[BostonRedSox]

To also remain fair and unbiased, this is another clip from FJA's website specifically pertaining to output transformer upgrades in general:

What does the output transformer upgrade do for my tone?
In most cases an upgraded output transformer will give the amp a tighter, more defined and articulate tone. It will help balance out all the frequencies so the low end doesn't become too loose and turn to mud.

Good luck.

 

[YellowJacket]

Play your amp!
Get off the damn internet and play it! All the mods in the world won't make you a better player. If you can't play like Slash, Eddie, George, Vai, Zakk, Yngwie, etc. then my mods won't make you sound any closer to your hero's tone. Spend your time playing and learning how to play better.

YES!!! So much tone is controlled by the player, probably more than we will ever know. My favourite experiment has been to have several people play my guitar through my amp and cab with my settings and to hear how different they all sound. It is frankly surprising, you'd almost think it was a different setup.

Play your amp!One piece of the pie
An amp is just one piece of the pie that makes up your tone. The speakers, speaker cabinet, guitar, strings, pickups, the room, and most of all your fingers all play a part in the end result of what you hear come out of an amp. Anyone of those things could be the weak link in getting what you want to hear from an amp. I can't fix any of those things which are all beyond my control in performing an amp mod.

Certain people swear by tubes, pickups, guitars, amps, cabs, speakers, etc. Personally, I have discovered that much mud is a result of speaker cab design but EVERY PART of the signal chain contributes. Some guitars have a much clearer sound than others, some pickups also sound clearer while others are more muddy. The same goes for an amp and a cab. My Gibson Les Paul is very clear and articulate and on top of that, the Bare Knuckle Rebel Yells are also very even, clear, and phat. Both cabs I play are super tight, clear, and handle gain like a champ. So it stands to reason that I don't need to mod my Dual to sound less muddy since it doesn't sound muddy to begin with. Contrary to popular belief, I think the complexity and nuance in the Dual Rectifier's distorted tone is actually a very attractive characteristic. You just need a cab that doesn't mask it with piles of standing waves.

Play your amp!Don't believe what you read!
Again, get off the damn internet and play it! There is sooooo much ******** information online, in forums, and in magazines about amps and gear it will make your head spin. ANYTHING you read is someone elses opinion, this crap I write included. What one person likes or the way one person perceives the tone of an amp, pedal, guitar, or speaker doesn't mean you will have the same results. Use your head and more importantly your ears to do your own research to find what YOU need. Most of the popular stuff you see is popular because of marketing, not because it was the best. A lot of fancy pictures and name dropping doesn't equal better or the best. Biggest mod shop in the USA? Says who and by what standard? Most unhappy customers? Most come backs? Biggest lies? Square footage? More marketing ********.

Yuck to hype. Gibson makes money because people know who they are. I personally swore by Celestions but when I heard they were outsourcing to China and their quality was dropping I got understandably pissed off!! Like come on, $180+ for a UK made speaker now? On the recommendation of ScreamingDaisy, I checked out Warehouse Guitar Speakers and I discovered the build quality and tone is outstanding. $100 CAD after tax for a brand new speaker and they even LOOK higher quality than the Celestions. My father in law, who doesn't know guitar gear, was SURPRISED that the CHINESE Celestions retailed for $150CAD new a piece because they look cheaper.

To also remain fair and unbiased, this is another clip from FJA's website specifically pertaining to output transformer upgrades in general:

What does the output transformer upgrade do for my tone?
In most cases an upgraded output transformer will give the amp a tighter, more defined and articulate tone. It will help balance out all the frequencies so the low end doesn't become too loose and turn to mud.

Good luck.

+1000000 on all of your post!!!! And ya, John rules! Great guy. It is good to see that he runs his business with absolute integrity!

A good cab will help with tightness and lack of mud as well! Of course this is my opinion so go try gear instead of listening to me!

 

[94Tremoverb]

pataklp is asking about the different transformer purely for cost reasons though - it's the PT he needs to change, to run on the European supply voltage.

Actually the PT has very little, to no, effect on the tone if it's an exact-spec replacement, so if you can be certain that it's *exact*, there's no harm in going with the cheaper version. If it's claimed to be an upgrade, it might still be better as long as you know what is being upgraded - with a PT, it can only really be power capacity, and this will make the tone slightly stiffer, but it would need a lot of a change to be audible.

To be honest I'm still surprised that Mesa will even sell you the export PT given their policy in Europe, so it doesn't surprise me too much that there is a cheaper option, even from a company that specialises in expensive aftermarket ones.

 

[pataklp]

I think you are right. Why changing and taking any risk, it's not so big difference in the price, few bucks. So I'll stick to mesa. And 'bout the selling. Yes, they are selling them. Just they don't wanna sell it in here, in America, they can ship it straight to my address in Europe, and in my country, you don't have a mesa dealer. So I guess that's the reason why. And if we had a dealer, I could just buy one straight from them, without paying the shipment costs.

 

[YellowJacket]

pataklp is asking about the different transformer purely for cost reasons though - it's the PT he needs to change, to run on the European supply voltage.

Actually the PT has very little, to no, effect on the tone if it's an exact-spec replacement, so if you can be certain that it's *exact*, there's no harm in going with the cheaper version. If it's claimed to be an upgrade, it might still be better as long as you know what is being upgraded - with a PT, it can only really be power capacity, and this will make the tone slightly stiffer, but it would need a lot of a change to be audible.

To be honest I'm still surprised that Mesa will even sell you the export PT given their policy in Europe, so it doesn't surprise me too much that there is a cheaper option, even from a company that specialises in expensive aftermarket ones.

HA, no kidding. If the aftermarket 'boutique' unit is less expensive, definitely get that part since it doesn't affect tone.