Mark V problem

[leeroy3636]

Hi everyone, I'm a newbie here, aplogies if this has been asked before, I did a search but could not find anything relevant.

I am new to Mesa gear, I purchased a 2nd hand Mark V a few weeks ago, its only had bedroom use & not a lot of that, its in mint condition etc, tested before purchase without the footswitch at low & high volumes & all ok, I had to buy a new footswitch as the previous owner lost it in a house move & he never used it.

Tested at home to find sounds etc prior to gigging it, using the new footswitch & all ok, I have gigged it twice, last night at a gig, channel 3 stopped working properly & channel 1 has an intermittent fizz happening, like the tweed is trying to kick in. Been using the 45 watt option on all 3 channels, using the effects loop & footswitch - channel 2 sounds fine.

Had the amp out today to test as I thought it maybe a footswitch problem, using just the amp with no footswitch or loop, channel 1 & 2 are fine, channel 3 works but sounds really thin, gain does not alter a lot etc, the only thing that seems to make any difference is switching modes on the mini toggles & the master, this only slightly changes the very thin unusable sound.

So thinking I have two things going on here, channel 1 problem may be footswitch or loop related & channel 3 I have no clue ?

I would like some pointers before I contact a service centre, if anyone has experienced this - could it be a valve ? Not up on how the mark v works, so thinking another valve or something kicks in on channel 3 ????

I have to add, although the amp has great sounds (when it works), as a gigging player I am not impressed at all with the reliability - these are not bedroom amps after all !

Back to the trusty Marshall for the foreseable future, I hope there is a quick fix, as the amp is the ultimate dream amp in my view.

 

[screamingdaisy]

Check the preamp tubes.

Mesa makes reliable amps, but they can't do much about the quality of the tubes.

 

[leeroy3636]

Check the preamp tubes.

Mesa makes reliable amps, but they can't do much about the quality of the tubes.

Tubes are original & had very little use, would any valve deteriorate through lack of use ?

I have been advised that the 12AX7s may be the cause, as far as I know they are either ruby's or sovteks rebranded by the chinese & russians for Mesa, amongst many others.

I do find these problems a tad alarming, due to the very small amount of bedroom use I know the amp has had in the past, I just quoted the trusty Marsall, because I have used it for the last 6 years & many gigs later & all the manhandling that goes with that, just one power tube has blown in that time - Mesa has very little use, then two gigs & something is very wrong.

Thanks for the heads up, I will check those 12 AX7's first.

 

[screamingdaisy]

Tubes are original & had very little use, would any valve deteriorate through lack of use ?

In my experience tubes tend to either die fairly early or last forever. Mesa can only test whether they work or not and can't predict how long they'll last... it's why they offer a 6 month warranty on them. If he had played it more it probably would've failed sooner rather than later and he would've been able to get a free replacement.

 

[67mike]

If it makes you feel better....I was at a very large and well known Amp repair depot recently and I saw about 30 Marshall Heads sitting with repair tags waiting for pickup.....NOT ONE MESA BOOGIE.

I made a comment to one of the guys I was dealing with and he said...ya they get Boogies too....but like I say there was a shitload of Marshalls that needed repair.

The issues with your amp are most likely Tube related. I think Mesa tubes suck.....so do a billion other people.

 

[leeroy3636]

If it makes you feel better....I was at a very large and well known Amp repair depot recently and I saw about 30 Marshall Heads sitting with repair tags waiting for pickup.....NOT ONE MESA BOOGIE.

I made a comment to one of the guys I was dealing with and he said...ya they get Boogies too....but like I say there was a sh!t of Marshalls that needed repair.

The issues with your amp are most likely Tube related. I think Mesa tubes suck.....so do a billion other people.

Thanks for the heads up, that is good to know & does make me feel better about it, but I probably feel the same about all equipment that is manufactured by a large corporation, I trust nothing until I have road tested it myself.
I have no doubt that the Mesa is quality built etc, I just wish these manufacturers would admit there are failings, I know there are ongoing footswitch connection problems with the mark v, that have not been addressed yet & as I said these are not bedroom amps !

The footswitch problems are similar to the Marshall being multi pin, I had issues with mine, a brand new TSL 212 after a few gigs, like most manufacturers they cut corners. The footswitch connection to the pcb was totally inadequate for gig use, it took some time to find the problem, returned to Marshall under warranty twice & came back the same, Marshall never found the problem, all that time I had to beg & borrow an amp, so I gave up on them. Finally got a fellow muso to look at it, he's an instrument tech as well, he made the floppy pcb connection more solid with a plastic choc & soldered in a failsafe across to each pin connection using fine copper wire - it worked a treat & never had any problems since, years later Marshall finally admitted the problem & sorted it on the later amps.

I actually liked the sound of the mark v when I used it & it is my dream amp, so will be putting Mesa tubes back in, personally I think the tube debate will go on forever, from my view using the amp mostly for live gigs, it would be very hard to tell the difference in tube sound in a live gig situation.

What tubes do most users prefer ?

The amp came with two spare 6L6 tubes & the 12AX7's are on their way, so hopefully everything will be ok very soon.

 

[screamingdaisy]

What tubes do most users prefer ?

You name it and chances are someone on here prefers it.

The only change I made to mine is swapping the power tubes for EL34s. More crunch.

I had a Tung Sol in the V1 position, but I took it out to use in another amp that needed it more. Honestly, I didn't find it made a huge difference in this particular amp.

 

[leeroy3636]

Found this on youtube, very helpful info :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSl-l9aWDHw

I knew the Mark V would be complex, but did not realise the relationship between tubes & different channels is so intricate - so looking at the valve spec on the manual it seems that channel 1 & 3 share two preamp tubes in the various modes, so I am thinking that my problems will be solved by changing tube 1 or 3 or both.

Original problems - no guts to channel 3 & intermittent distortion on channel 1

Is looking at tube 1 & 3 the best place to start ?

Looking forward to getting this done now, thanks to those that replied, I am glad I came here first.

 

[67mike]

If it makes you feel better....I was at a very large and well known Amp repair depot recently and I saw about 30 Marshall Heads sitting with repair tags waiting for pickup.....NOT ONE MESA BOOGIE.

I made a comment to one of the guys I was dealing with and he said...ya they get Boogies too....but like I say there was a sh!t of Marshalls that needed repair.

The issues with your amp are most likely Tube related. I think Mesa tubes suck.....so do a billion other people.

Thanks for the heads up, that is good to know & does make me feel better about it, but I probably feel the same about all equipment that is manufactured by a large corporation, I trust nothing until I have road tested it myself.
I have no doubt that the Mesa is quality built etc, I just wish these manufacturers would admit there are failings, I know there are ongoing footswitch connection problems with the mark v, that have not been addressed yet & as I said these are not bedroom amps !

The footswitch problems are similar to the Marshall being multi pin, I had issues with mine, a brand new TSL 212 after a few gigs, like most manufacturers they cut corners. The footswitch connection to the pcb was totally inadequate for gig use, it took some time to find the problem, returned to Marshall under warranty twice & came back the same, Marshall never found the problem, all that time I had to beg & borrow an amp, so I gave up on them. Finally got a fellow muso to look at it, he's an instrument tech as well, he made the floppy pcb connection more solid with a plastic choc & soldered in a failsafe across to each pin connection using fine copper wire - it worked a treat & never had any problems since, years later Marshall finally admitted the problem & sorted it on the later amps.

I actually liked the sound of the mark v when I used it & it is my dream amp, so will be putting Mesa tubes back in, personally I think the tube debate will go on forever, from my view using the amp mostly for live gigs, it would be very hard to tell the difference in tube sound in a live gig situation.

What tubes do most users prefer ?

The amp came with two spare 6L6 tubes & the 12AX7's are on their way, so hopefully everything will be ok very soon.

Personally I think MESA power tubes SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have had horrid experiences with them.

Bought a new quad of 6L6's for the Mark V........originals were only 7 months old and I play in basement at less than half volume......new ones gave me grief and ended up red-plating.


Just bought a set of Mesa EL34's for my new Rivera.....fricken throw them in ...sounds like a baby rattle!!! Bypassed the preamp...running only power tubes rattle like crazy! Took those turds out returned them for a set of JJ EL34's....JJ's are PERFECT!

I think mesa must buy the rejected tubes from whoever sells them the cheapest...they hand test them to see if they can use them then sell them to us suckers under the "warranty" period.

 

[farren]

Personally I think MESA power tubes SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have had horrid experiences with them.

Bought a new quad of 6L6's for the Mark V........originals were only 7 months old and I play in basement at less than half volume......new ones gave me grief and ended up red-plating.


Just bought a set of Mesa EL34's for my new Rivera.....fricken throw them in ...sounds like a baby rattle!!! Bypassed the preamp...running only power tubes rattle like crazy! Took those turds out returned them for a set of JJ EL34's....JJ's are PERFECT!

I think mesa must buy the rejected tubes from whoever sells them the cheapest...they hand test them to see if they can use them then sell them to us suckers under the "warranty" period.

From the bottom of my heart, I hope when you get your Mark back you prefer the Rivera and tell us all about how you sell it. This is becoming tiresome.

 

[bandit2013]

Found this on youtube, very helpful info :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSl-l9aWDHw

I knew the Mark V would be complex, but did not realise the relationship between tubes & different channels is so intricate - so looking at the valve spec on the manual it seems that channel 1 & 3 share two preamp tubes in the various modes, so I am thinking that my problems will be solved by changing tube 1 or 3 or both.

Original problems - no guts to channel 3 & intermittent distortion on channel 1

Is looking at tube 1 & 3 the best place to start ?

Looking forward to getting this done now, thanks to those that replied, I am glad I came here first.

Power tubes can be toublesome, especially new manufactured tubes. It is all process related especially when they pump out the tube and how long the heat the internals, etc...

Is your amp a combo or head? If it is a head you almost certainly have to pull the amp out of the shell in order to get good acess to the V1 tube since there is not much room for hands and a mirror to get the tube back in.
V1 would be the first tube to check since that one affects all channels, then the last one in the loop V7.

 

[farren]

I'd say my hands are of average size, but I don't have trouble accessing V1 (or any other tube) in my Mark V head as long as I remove power tubes first. It won't be necessary for most people to remove the chassis. This can be done blind, just pay attention to the orientation of the tube pins when you take each out. One of the sockets, either V2 or V3, I forget, is flipped 180 degrees from the others. I believe it's the one that is nearer to the rear of the amp.

 

[67mike]

Hey buddy, why don't ya shut your pompus yap. Seriously. :roll:

 

[bandit2013]

I'd say my hands are of average size, but I don't have trouble accessing V1 (or any other tube) in my Mark V head as long as I remove power tubes first. It won't be necessary for most people to remove the chassis. This can be done blind, just pay attention to the orientation of the tube pins when you take each out. One of the sockets, either V2 or V3, I forget, is flipped 180 degrees from the others. I believe it's the one that is nearer to the rear of the amp.

I have tried that, I could not get my hands in to twist off the spring loaded caps. (big hands and big fingers). I found it easier to pull the chassis than having to rebend the preamp tubes. First time I did it the hard way, then I had to remove the amp just to get the tubes back in.

 

[farren]

Consider me envious--while I can reach around and under to pull my V1 tube, I bet you can easily play octaves on the piano or perform epic stretches on extended scale guitars

 

[mesa metal]

boy am i glad i got the combo :wink:

 

[SteveO]

boy am i glad i got the combo :wink:

Let's revisit that thought in a year or so, when the arm that you use to carry that combo is three inches longer than the other one.

 

[leeroy3636]

Power tubes can be toublesome, especially new manufactured tubes. It is all process related especially when they pump out the tube and how long the heat the internals, etc...

Is your amp a combo or head? If it is a head you almost certainly have to pull the amp out of the shell in order to get good acess to the V1 tube since there is not much room for hands and a mirror to get the tube back in.
V1 would be the first tube to check since that one affects all channels, then the last one in the loop V7.

Thanks for that, I will start with No 1, I got an email back from Mesa UK & they suggested going through the preamp tubes one by one.

My amp is a combo, I have small hands so can get to everything, I have had a look around inside & have to remove the power tubes for access, but I think everything will be ok when the 12AX7's arrive, I found a small torch helpful.
I can't wait to get it done, I was actually getting somewhere near to the sounds I wanted for live stuff, needs a bit more tweaking tho, this is a minor setback.

I am impressed more than anything with the cleans that you can get from the mark v, I play in 3 covers bands so need lots of sounds, this amp does them all with no problems, channel 2 & 3 sounds roll back nicely on the volume too, which is not always the case.

BTW - With my small hands, I can't even do a thumb over on a bar chord even on the slimmest neck, so major stretches are also out for me, I have to find some other way when required !

 

[leeroy3636]

boy am i glad i got the combo :wink:

Let's revisit that thought in a year or so, when the arm that you use to carry that combo is three inches longer than the other one.

Lol, in my case the Mark V is 20lbs lighter than the Marshall combo, but still heavy & I took the casters off - in my opinion just a small price to pay for a decent tone, just need to get another one to balance the arms out so both will be three inches longer

 

[mesa metal]

boy am i glad i got the combo :wink:

Let's revisit that thought in a year or so, when the arm that you use to carry that combo is three inches longer than the other one.

Lol, in my case the Mark V is 20lbs lighter than the Marshall combo, but still heavy & I took the casters off - in my opinion just a small price to pay for a decent tone, just need to get another one to balance the arms out so both will be three inches longer

thats great :lol: you guys made my day.....sooo funny....i put the casters back on so i could roll it before i pick it up and throw out my shoulder :wink:
its like a giant suitcase......but boy it sounds fantastic... :twisted: oh and im hauling the 2x12 with it