Mark IV no longer satisfying

[tele_steve]

Hi all--

Newbie to the forum here. I've had a Mark IV head since 1991. It just isn't sounding as good as it used to, and frankly, I've never been 100% satisfied with the tone. I'd like more bottom end, and more gain in rhythm 2. I'm looking for a pretty much straight-ahead "classic" rock tone, maybe with a bit more gain--nothing crazy, no de-tuning or anything. Just replaced the power tubes with two MESA 6L6s and two MESA EL34s, which give me even less bottom!

Playing through a 1x12 open back cab with a Vintage 30. Guitars are a Fender Tele Plus and Peavey Wolfgang.

Thanks!

 

[zodiac272]

welcome,

have you ever tried to put your 1x12 on top of a EV 12L loaded thiele? or maybe some different tubes to get more low end if possible? Are you saying it's a bit thin? maybe hotter pup's? or maybe a different amp is for you?

scott

 

[dodger916]

I also had reservations about the bottom-end of my Mark IVb until I added an EVM-loaded Thiele. I find runnning two speakers really enhances the sound and feel. I'm not crazy about V30's with a Mark IV. If you're going to run only one speaker, I'd suggest a C-90, EVM 12-L, or Eminence MS-12.

It probably needs a cap job by now, which should enhance the bottom end. Or get an Electra-Dyne and have all the bottom-end you'll ever want plus plenty of great classic rock tones, though not as high gain as a Mark.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

EV Thiele cab.
C-90 in your existing cab.
4 x 6L6 power tubes.

I'm not really a fan of the IV, but you might find the tones you're looking for if you try these suggestions.
The V-30 is very shrill to my ears if it's the only speaker you're using.

As for more gain in R2, you might try some JJ or Ruby High Gain preamp tubes.

Or...you might simply be a Mark III guy. I think the Blue Strip Mark III blows the Mark IV out of the water for thump and raw distortion.

FWIW: I had a Mark IV A (one with 2 loops) and a DC-10 at the same time. I did a lengthy shoot out between the 2 and ended up keeping the DC.
I found the DC to be a little more raw on the distortion, had lots more thump in the bass department, and the cleans were not as sterile. Sure it doesn't have the R2 option, but I didn't like R2 on the Mark IV anyway, so I never used it!

 

[mule#1]

I agree with dodger and monsta-tone on the V-30's. The Mark series amps sound much better with a C-90 or an EV speaker. Two easy things you can try are making sure your speaker cab or combo is setting directly on the floor and in a corner or against a wall. This will add bore bass or thump. If the speaker or combo is on casters or an amp stand it looses low end. More importantly is to play that thing through an enclosed speaker. A lot of low end is generated by the restricted air movement.

Secondly take a look at your settings. Try using the settings suggested by boogie. I have never felt like I don't get enough low end out of my MK IV.

My last thought is you might be hearing a lack of low mids? If you scoop your mids out all the way in the classic V shape you loose some low mid frequencies that can be mistaken for bass. Try turning up the mid's on your tone control as well! Oh and Rhythm 2 is what it is on the early amps lol.

Good luck and hope that helps!

 

[mixn4him1]

I would have to disagree here, I have a MKIV (A) and it does have a V30 in the combo cab (previous owner installed) and agreed it is not the best combination. BUT I bought an Orange 1x12 SEALED cab with a V30 in it and it sounds ridiculous! Plenty of low end thump and much more balanced sounding. V30's are not meant to be used in an open back cab they need the sealed back to reinforce the low end and balance out the highs....

I do agree so new tubes may be in order I have a full set of JJ's with a Tung Sol Balanced in the PI position and have more then enough gain in all three channels..

Good luck..

 

[JAZZGEAR]

EV Thiele cab.
C-90 in your existing cab.
4 x 6L6 power tubes.

I'm not really a fan of the IV, but you might find the tones you're looking for if you try these suggestions.
The V-30 is very shrill to my ears if it's the only speaker you're using.

As for more gain in R2, you might try some JJ or Ruby High Gain preamp tubes.

Or...you might simply be a Mark III guy. I think the Blue Strip Mark III blows the Mark IV out of the water for thump and raw distortion.

FWIW: I had a Mark IV A (one with 2 loops) and a DC-10 at the same time. I did a lengthy shoot out between the 2 and ended up keeping the DC.
I found the DC to be a little more raw on the distortion, had lots more thump in the bass department, and the cleans were not as sterile. Sure it doesn't have the R2 option, but I didn't like R2 on the Mark IV anyway, so I never used it!

Bingo! I have to agree...I just sold my Mark III Blue Stripe combo, and it blew away my Mark IV...I hated having to sell it. But an amp had to go to make room for the RA-100, and the Mark IV was a custom build and too much monies to let it go for what they are fetching now....plus I don't feel I've gotten enough use out of it to let it depreciate like that in a sale. Maybe in 5 years or so.... :mrgreen:

 

[screamingdaisy]

I've hated both the EVM-12L and C90 with Marks and much prefer the V30. Guess it comes down to tastes.

Anyway, if you like the V30 and you want more bottom end the answer is fairly simple... get a 2x12 or 4x12 closed back cab full of V30s. Or, if you don't like V30s and want more bottom end then get a 2x12 or 4x12 closed back cab full of whatever speaker you happen to like.

I can't help you with R2. Shy of using a pedal or hotter pickups there's not a whole lot to be done.

 

[Neptical]

EV Thiele cab.
C-90 in your existing cab.
4 x 6L6 power tubes.

I'm not really a fan of the IV, but you might find the tones you're looking for if you try these suggestions.
The V-30 is very shrill to my ears if it's the only speaker you're using.

As for more gain in R2, you might try some JJ or Ruby High Gain preamp tubes.

Or...you might simply be a Mark III guy. I think the Blue Strip Mark III blows the Mark IV out of the water for thump and raw distortion.
FWIW: I had a Mark IV A (one with 2 loops) and a DC-10 at the same time. I did a lengthy shoot out between the 2 and ended up keeping the DC.
I found the DC to be a little more raw on the distortion, had lots more thump in the bass department, and the cleans were not as sterile. Sure it doesn't have the R2 option, but I didn't like R2 on the Mark IV anyway, so I never used it!

+1,000.

You hit it on the head, Monsta. I've never been a V30 fan myself as you mentioned, they're just too harsh on the ears. I've found my old broken in G12T-75s to be a perfect fit for my Marks. Sweet,thumpy and smooth with enough grit to sit in the mix perfect. That's to say nothing about my G12K-100s as they are monstrous with my Marks, but a different beast all together.

Tele Steve - I'd suggest sending her in to Mike B. at Boogie if you think it's lost the magic - along with replacing the preamp tubes. She would probably put a smile back on your face after that!

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I would have to disagree here, I have a MKIV (A) and it does have a V30 in the combo cab (previous owner installed) and agreed it is not the best combination. BUT I bought an Orange 1x12 SEALED cab with a V30 in it and it sounds ridiculous! Plenty of low end thump and much more balanced sounding. V30's are not meant to be used in an open back cab they need the sealed back to reinforce the low end and balance out the highs....

I didn't like the Mesa 1x12 closed back cab with the V-30 in it.
That being said, I used to have a Lee Jackson Ampeg 2x12 speaker cab. Angled front, closed back with 2 V-30's in it. That was the best cabinet I have ever played through for metal.
But....I could never figure out why my cleans sounded so brittle. Then...I discovered the C-90 and it's been all down hill from there!