Mark III ground switch - getting shocked

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Tom P

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The ground switch on my Mark III seems to be live and functional, in one setting I was getting shocked by my guitar strings--not a good feeling. ISs this something I should have looked at? I prefer to work on amps myself *if* it's pretty straightforward.
 
Not necessarily, unless you feel there's some insidious failure in the amp. <-- legal disclaimer! :mrgreen:

Getting shocked at the strings is usually preceded by touching your lips to a mic or another guitarists strings. That's a ground loop and can be removed by changing the position of your ground switch. it will wither switch polarity or lift the ground completely. Flick the switch, check for a zap, adjust more if needed. It's not uncommon but always unwanted. I usually already have my hands on the strings and touch the mic, finding the grounding problem with my lips! THAT sucks. :x
 
Does this happen all the time no matter what outlet you are plugged in? Maybe it's just that particular outlet that isn't grounded...but if it happens regardless of any outlet, the problem is wiring within the amp...if not, it's the outlet, you can buy an outlet tester to see if the leads are properly connected, it's just a small plug with color coded lights.
 
Could be but it's fine with whatever it's switched to now. I do have an outlet tester though and I'll check the outlet if it does it again.
 
Can't remember when, but I think it was 1993.
The National Electrical Code did away with ground switches and made it so that all appliances (yep, my amp is a dish washer) had a grounded cord.

On most of the amps I work on, I remove the capacitor that ties the ground switch to the chassis. I also replace the crappy, ungrounded, cord with a new 16 or 14 gauge grounded cord.
The problem is, you are placing your life and lively hood in the hands of a $.25 capacitor (now they cost about $1.00).
If the capacitor fails, shorts, whatever, you will get AC voltage on the chassis of the amp!

I used to play in places that had shitty wiring. I was always getting shocked by the mic when I would touch my strings.
I started carrying a plug tester and a long extension cord (heavy duty 14 or 12 gauge).
I would test plugs and not stop until I found one that was properly grounded. This was the plug I would use.

Even if the plugs you are using are grounded.....
I would definitely get rid of the so-called "Death-Cap" on the ground switch and make sure your cord is properly grounded.
There are far better ways of eliminating ground loops than using the switch on your amp!
 
I found this article here: http://psg.com/~dlamkins/lamkins-guitar/music/article/ground-switch-death-cap

Ground Switches and Death Caps:
This is probably more than you ever wanted to know about ground switches and "death caps"...

In the US, conventional power outlets have one side of the line at ground potential and the other side connected to the "hot" lead. The ground switch works by creating a high-impedance connection, through the grounding or "death" capacitor, between the chassis and one side of the AC line. The "correct" connection attaches the capacitor to the grounded side of the AC line, thus putting the chassis at ground potential for AC frequencies.

The cap really was necessary; without it, leakage currents (mostly from the power transformer) would put some small amount of AC voltage on the chassis. With the entire circuit floating up and down on the AC voltage, a certain amount of imbalanced voltage would get injected into the circuit and cause hum. The cap simply shunted the chassis voltage to ground, greatly reducing the magnitude of the voltage and reducing hum.

The ground switch itself was a convenience. Most products of the era had the cap without the switch; you'd have to reverse the AC plug in the outlet to get the proper connection.

All this came about because grounded outlets, although available, were not required by the electrical code until sometime in the `70s, I think. Grounded outlets were preceded by polarized outlets which had one prong wider than the other. A matching polarized plug could only be inserted one way. For backward compatibility, a non-polarized plug could be inserted either way. Before that, of course, both plugs and outlets were non-polarized (and ungrounded). Now that we have grounded outlets almost everywhere, the function of the ground cap has been replaced by a direct connection from the chassis to the safety ground through the round pin of a 3-wire plug.

The "death cap" appellation is fairly recent. My cynical side says that the name was probably invented to drum up business for amp techs... The name is appropriate, even if it does overstate its case. What can happen is that the capacitor can fail shorted which allows it to pass DC. That's like wiring the chassis directly to the AC line, which is a lot like sticking a finger into one side of the AC outlet; you have a 50/50 chance of getting zapped.

The cap may fail shorted due to manufacturing defect (rare) or dielectric punch-through. A capacitor is made of two strips of metal separated by an insulator, or dielectric. The dielectric is rated to withstand a certain amount of voltage. Higher voltages may breach the dielectric. The grounding cap is subjected to line voltage when not properly connected (switch or plug in the wrong position). Line voltage is nominally 120 volts AC (now; it has crept up by a few percent over the decades) and a properly-manufactured and rated cap will tolerate that for many, many decades. However, AC line voltage is not "clean"; it's host to much higher spike voltages that happen when motors get switched off or when there's a nearby lightning strike. A high-voltage spike can punch through a weak spot in the dielectric material, burning a tiny permanent hole and - via carbonization or welding of the electrodes - create a DC path through the capacitor.

Now, getting zapped with the full 120 volts is unpleasant (I can vouch for that) but not universally fatal (ditto). It happened a lot in the days when vacuum tubes could be purchased at the corner store, and very few people died from the experience. Guitarists, though, are at greater risk than the general public because they have a firm grip on a piece of metal connnected to the chassis. If that grounding cap fails shorted and the grounding switch (or plug) is set wrong, the unlucky guitarist is going to be connected to the AC line. Assuming that the guitarist is wearing non-conductive shoes and not touching anything else, he'll notice a buzzing sensation which may range from noticeable to somewhat unpleasant. At that point, touching any grounded piece of metal - say a microphone - completes the path. If the path of the electricity through the guitarist's body happens to involve the heart, we end up with a "late, as in departed" (gratuitous Douglas Adams quote), guitarist.
 
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