JP2C Settings Thead

[Markedman]

Here's my settings for last nights practice, they moved around quite a bit and I ended up here at the end of the night. I play classic rock. No shred mode or pulled knobs and I'm playing through an open 1x12 EV and a C90 Mesa thiele.

https://flic.kr/p/KQT8zw

 

[nitefly]

Take that as a loose guide, but I think the above was in the ballpark of 'master of puppets' tone for channel 2. I'm pretty sure the prescense is pushed here, I'm aware it's in 2C mode when pulled, so if you want pulled you'll need to roll it back to absolutely no more than noon IMO, so feel free to do that as an alternative.

Obviously the master volume is low here as well.

Finally, as a Mesa newbie, the controls on Mesas are so counter-intuitive to my acquired knowledge from playing other amps. I'd say, perhaps arrogantly but perhaps fairy, that I'm quite a clever chap but even studying the manual couldn't prepare me for the need to pay attention to the treble control. By adding treble, you also add volume, gain, mids, bass and upper highs that would be 'prescense'!!! Takes some time getting used to!!!

The mid control is also amusing - it makes such a small tone difference compared to the trebel, barely any. I completely agree that it adds no gain either (as another user has commented). It clearly does something though, because if you turn trebel and bass off, twiddling the mid control does make volume go up and down.

So generally, I'd say mids and bass are best controlled with the sliders. The trebel is best controlled with the trebel knob, gain and presence controls, but the sliders help a lot with fine tuning.

Speaking generally of course!! :lol:

 

[fatbagg]

The mid knob on most mark amps adds a fullness or fatness in and around the mid frequencies. It isn't like most amps where you turn the mid knob and get hi mid, or a change in overall tone. The mid knob on Mark amps is more a "feel". The sliders are more the sound and tone.

 

[nitefly]

I completely agree

Also, I've been having a look at Rasmussen's Metallica settings and looks like my settings above are ' 'way off', but it still has that distinct vibe so clearly the album has a 'boogie' sound!

Going to have a go at translating some of Rasmussen's settings onto the JP-2c tonight

 

[Bullen]

It shouldn't be that hard to translate those settings.

But, you should probably use ch 3 with the gain pulled as I think they used a Volume setting of 9, which should be about right on the JP with the gain pulled on ch 3. Set the other knobs to the same as those notes and it should be pretty close. Remember that Lead drive on the C+ = gain on the JP. Pull the presence also to duplicate the C+ presence.

Keep in mind that they used a parametric eq also to further boost the highs and lows and to scoop more mids. Probably some more eq in the mix also. And they may have used Marshalls as poweramps on MOP and probably Mesa Strategy 400 poweramps on AJFA.

I've tried some of those settings on my JP and they sound very good.

 

[Bullen]

So looking at Flemmings notes for the song Sanitarium on MOP, set the JP as follows:

Ch 3 - Gain 5 pull - Tre 7 (this shift on the c+ is always pulled on the JP so that is correct) - mid 4 - bass 2 - master 4 (deep is always pulled on the JP, also correct)- Pres 4,5 pull. Then just duplicate the eq setting and that's pretty much it.

However, since they also used a parametric eq you might want to boost the 80hz and the 6600 more to get even closer if you don't have one. I think the boost was about 4 db at 120 hz and 6 db at 4.6 kHz. The mid cut was about -6db at 1.2 kHz on MOP. On AJFA they seem to have used 2 eq's to further boost the the lows/low mids in the 250-300 hz range and the highs in the 6-8 kHz range. The mids were also further cut in the 750hz-1k range. So for that tone use 2 different eq's, one set similar to the MOP settings and one to further boost the highs and lows and cut the mids. That is a lot of eq and not a lot of mids. On the albums it sounds good though.

But back to the amp. The only difference is that the JP doesn't have the lead master, but that is mostly used to balance the clean and lead volumes, so it doesn't matter much if any. And that on the JP the lead bright is always pulled, but on the notes the lead bright is pushed. You might compensate for that with a lower presence setting perhaps. And they may have used C++ amps, at least on AJFA and TBA.

 

[SamuelJ86]

MOP tone's have a lot of variables. Its tough to get close to those tones, imo. But, what I think the JP2C does very well is the black album. The warmth and low end coming from the JP2C helps me get a very convincing black album tone. Especially tracks like Holier Than Thou and Wherever I May Roam. My mark V couldn't do Metallica anywhere even close to how good the JP2C does it. I'm using channel 2, GEQ 1, and a les paul with a 498t in the bridge.
I'm using channel 3 with a different guitar tuned to drop B. It has a gain boost built in and I'm using shred mode. I bump up the gain to around noon without the boost.

 

[nitefly]

^ Those look fun will try them out!

I have an empress para EQ and an MXR 10 band, so I should be able to get somewhere near the 'Justice' tones. I did have a very quick go last night with AJFA settings with the 2 EQs active and it did sound virtually identical, but admittedly very thin outside the context of the full track mix, which is what it sounds like if you search for the isolated guitar tracks on youtube. I imagine the CDs have the bass guitar filling out the lower frequencies, even if it's indistinguishable from the rhythm guitars.

Such fun 8)

 

[nitefly]

So... here we have the setting for the rhythm guitars on the AJFA title track (which incidentally are the same settings as Blackened).

Very conveniently, the two EQ settings are explained here: http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=50309#p463819

EQ 1
4.6khz +6db, shelving
1.2khz -6db, peaking
120hz +4db, shelving
Filter is roughly 20khz lo pass, and 100hz hi pass, so anything below 100hz is cut off and anything above 20khz is cut off.

EQ 2
6.6khz +6db, shelving
1khz (roughly) -6db, peaking
300hz (roughly) -4db, peaking
No filter

I don't have access to fancy rack EQs which shelving functions, and I imagine this is the case for a couple of people, so I thought I would try and visualise what the EQs look like stacked on top of each other, as a rough guide for replicating the settings without using the fancy rack EQs.

Here's what I came up with - I thought I would share. As it says in the corner, the actual width of the peaks is not visually represented on the graph - just take this as a rough guide! Also, how the 1khz and 1.2khz peaks overlap is not accurately represented either - that would require the widths of the bands (the Q) to be accurately represented on the diagram. There in reality will be some overlap with the 1khz and 400hz peaks as the Q is relatively wide. Finally, yes, I write like a child.

 

[jhilbert]

Hi All,

Curious to hear everyone's opinion if you could get close to MOP/AJFA/Flemming notes with something like the Empress ParaEq pedal?

I think the JP-2C outright can nail early Metallica. I've owned a Mark IV and V:25 and have been satisfied with results. The JP-2C is a great amp and can certainly obtain the sound of the early albums. Just wondering if anyone has any experience with the Empress ParaEQ.

I also believe that nailing the exact studio sound is near impossible for many reasons, mainly, everyone hears something different and the full band + layering contributes other factors. But, I'm similar to many, I believe, and always feel that with a little tweaking I will eventually capture the exact sound.

Thanks!

 

[nitefly]

I had a go with both the Empress EQ and the MXR 10 band this evening.

Eh - it sort of works... if you follow the frequencies quoted above exactly, rather than "the CD" you end up sounding like a single track verion of this... or in the same ball park anyway, but not exact - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcW-MgN1M1o

So... yes it 'sounds like it' but I think that sounds incredibly thin by itself out of the band mix and top heavy. The settings on the Dusty demo of the JP-2C sound much nicer IMO. I imagine multi-layering and further compression helps. I haven't tried it in a band function / against a kit.

I would say that further EQs in the loop definitely helps though, particularly cutting 1-1.2Khz, boosting ~120hz and ~4-6khz. For Justice, cutting 300hz seems to help. But boosts of +/-6db seem a bit too extreme. ~3db sounds better to my ears.

Also, I prefer rolling back the treble slightly compared to the official settings, and increasing the gain slightly instead to compensate. That sounds fuller unaccompanied.

 

[Bullen]

Yeah, keep in mind that there is a lot of other things in the recording process that influence the the final result. Cab, microphones, mixing etc. Hetfield has said in the past that his live tone and recording tone are two different things. And that his recorded tone wouldn't work in a live setting even though he seems to have used a similar setup for both back in the day. Probably quite different settings live. A really scooped tone disappears when playing with a band in my experience, and his tone really dominated their live tone back then. Really thick, cutting, tight and powerful.

 

[TheocracyMatt]

Also, don't forget the HUGELY important variable in this discussion, and the one that no one ever seems to notice or mention: the speakers/cabs. Everyone thinks of the "all my speakers are Vintage 30s" quote from that post-Black Album guitar mag interview, but keep in mind that James didn't start using Vintage 30s on record til the Black Album. RtL, MoP and Justice were 300W Marshall cabs (as mentioned in Flemming's notes) with G12-65 speakers (the predecessor to the current G12T-75). Hetfield mentioned this in a guitar mag in 86, and it's very obvious when listening if you've spent time playing through both cabs.

It's weird that no one ever brings this up, since IMO the cab actually makes the biggest difference in tone (try it: two different heads through the same cab will sound much more similar than the same head through two different cabs). But a Mark series amp through a Marshall cab with 65s or 75s will get you much, much closer to MoP/AJFA than through a Mesa cab. The bottom end and the sound of the midrange is completely different. Black Album, on the other hand, Vintage 30s all the way.

Take it from a recording engineer nerd who spent waaaaay too many years of my youth chasing those tones.

Cheers,
Matt

 

[Bruceta]

These are my current settings:

- Shred on 2 and 3 sometimes
- Gain pulled on 2
- Presence not pulled

MIDI controlled via GT-10 (Channel, GEQs and Shred Mode)
4-cable method

Loving it!

 

[Markedman]

https://www.flickr.com/photos/100168049@N04/30216573535/in/dateposted-public/

9/9/16 outdoors and loud!

 

[GJgo]

Something I've been trying lately is that, compared to my Mark III, I think that:

-With Shred off (& treble knob at 4:30) I'm getting tones closer to when the bass knob is pulled (Whitesnake 1987 tone). A huge tone, but w/o those upper mids. I use a normal V-shape 80hz amount here.

-With Shred is on (& treble knob at 1:30) I'm getting tones closer to when the bass knob is pushed (Black Album tone). More of those signature Mesa upper mids. I also dime the 80hz slider.

I like the presence knobs in both positions for different reasons. haven't really dialed that one into anything specific yet.

 

[GJgo]

A new thing I've been trying in both my Marks is almost diming my presence, and pulling the upper end back with the GEQ. When I A/B this way vs. presence down & GEQ highs up, I feel like the former gives a more open feel to the tone. When I balance this with being careful to not run so much gain that it starts to compress the sound I feel like I'm getting some huge tones.

 

[Markedman]

https://www.flickr.com/photos/100168049@N04/32952742373/in/dateposted-public/

This setting really worked well tonight with just one 1X12 EV open back cabinet.

 

[Markedman]

I did something different last night and I found it to be quite good tone. I set the treble to 11 o'clock and pulled the presence and had that at 2 o'clock. The mid control has quite and impact on the overall aggressive tone with it turned up to 3 o'clock or more provides a nice bite, dial back to less than 12 o'clock retains the classic Boogie tone.

 

[Mrhiwatt]

I use settings similar to your last one all the time. Very versatile amp and easy to get good tones compared to some of the other Boogies

Mrhiwatt