IIC+ Tune Up and Restoration- UPDATED

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stokes said:
Ha! Remember the battles we had back then?Problem then was that I had never checked ESR so I had no absolute figures to back up my argument,just went with what I was taught and what I experienced doing cap jobs for years.I often wonder if those debates we had then had some effect on Mesa's stand.I remember so many people telling me "Mesa or Mike B told me the caps dont need changing".I would talk them into changing them and would always get positive feedback on the change.Now Mesa seems to have reversed and become proponents of changing caps.Anyways,getting back to the BMI's,I contacted a couple of the distributors listed on the Barker MFD site and they all seem to only want to deal in bulk.A couple actually directed me to suppliers that sell Vishay/Sprague,telling me they are made at the same plant.No help,although I still like Sprague Atoms,the price has driven me to use F&T more now.The only problem I foresee getting them from Mesa is that I'm sure they only stock the values they use.I havent gotten a lot of Boogie amps of late,I think I recapped all the MK's in the north east.I had a run there for a couple years when I probably did well over 100 Boogies.Many ofthem came as a result of the debates you and I had here.I've been getting more vintage amps that use 8,10,16 and 20uf,not too common in Mesa's.Prices are great from Mesa.Interesting note on the BMI site.BMI was actually begun by the guy named Barker who was the VP of Sprague and bought the factory where Sprague's were made,and actually are subcontracted by Sprague to make the Atoms.

Same here. It's been Fender or Ampeg. I did a studio pre last week with the dreaded no reverb and it was the same old 33K resistor.

I have been quite happy with F&T for non-boogie stuff. The prices for the Atom caps is just too high.
 
When filter caps get old,beyond ten years,they begin to deteriorate and the amps response begins to "loosen up".It isnt always noticeable because it is such a gradual decline.Most owners dont notice until the caps are replaced.When caps are replaced,the overall response of the amp tightens up,particularly in the bass.With the old caps there is often no obvious problems,excess hum etc.But in all the booogie amps I did,the owners were floored with the improvement.It is also a safety measure,as caps deteriorate they become a weak point,when a filter cap fails it can take out other components and often spew their guts all over the chassis and circuit boards,not fun to have to clean up.Caps have a finite life span,just like tubes,and should be changed periodically.I use ten years as a general guide,but depending on how often the amp is used it can be more or less.An amp that sits for long periods without being used is more prone to cap problems.When no current flows thru the caps they tend to dry out and fail.If you have an amp that doesnt get much use it is a good idea to turn it on and let the current flow for a while at least once a month.
 
I don't think my original IIC+ has ever had any maintenance done.

Should I send my IIC+ back to Mesa and have Mike B go over it and replace caps and stuff, or have someone else do a re-cap?
 
Sorry,dont know anybody up that way.I'm in NYC and Fishkill NY,Ed,Boogiebabies is down south.If you're gonna have to ship it,I'd ship it to Ed before Mesa.I dont deal with shipping myself.See if you can find a good tech in your area.
 
stokes said:
Sorry,dont know anybody up that way.I'm in NYC and Fishkill NY,Ed,Boogiebabies is down south.If you're gonna have to ship it,I'd ship it to Ed before Mesa.I dont deal with shipping myself.See if you can find a good tech in your area.

Just curious, why Ed before Mesa?
 
Ed did my C+. It was like having a close friend who truly cares do the work. He'd ask me questions about my playing styles, like/dislikes, etc., and recommend possible changes to the stock format, e.g, the bright reduction mod. No slam against Mesa, but would you rather take your car to a big dealership or a local mechanic you've known for years who still gets his hands dirty? Or like a neighborhood tailor versus the department store hack. It felt like personalized service, and I felt involved. Stokes too; he re-capped my Mark IV, and I dropped off the amp so we got to meet. I made two friends who I can now rely on for help or advice. Stokes even contacted me afterwards to make sure all was good.

p.s. I think Ed might be back in upstate NY, so shipping should be cheaper and quicker!

pps Thanks, Ed, for photo tutorial!
 
dodger916 said:
Ed did my C+. It was like having a close friend who truly cares do the work. He'd ask me questions about my playing styles, like/dislikes, etc., and recommend possible changes to the stock format, e.g, the bright reduction mod. No slam against Mesa, but would you rather take your car to a big dealership or a local mechanic you've known for years who still gets his hands dirty? Or like a neighborhood tailor versus the department store hack. It felt like personalized service, and I felt involved. Stokes too; he re-capped my Mark IV, and I dropped off the amp so we got to meet. I made two friends who I can now rely on for help or advice. Stokes even contacted me afterwards to make sure all was good.

p.s. I think Ed might be back in upstate NY, so shipping should be cheaper and quicker!

pps Thanks, Ed, for photo tutorial!

You're lucky you got that amp back Frank !!!! I am back upstate and need to schedule visitation with my
long lost Export...... Damn, at least you willed it to me.
 
JOEY B. said:
Since the re-cap, how goes the little Boogie hold up to the Bogner? I see the G-flex cab is still in action. :D

JB,

The recap tightened up the amp a good bit and the bottom end it pretty solid. Not a drastic change.
After the job my plate voltage only went down 2V, so those old caps were still functioning properly.
On old caps, as the ESR or effective series resistance goes up they tend to store, or as I say block more voltage.
I did one on a 60W and the old caps had the plates up to 474V and the amp sounded like a buzz saw and had no bottom end.
New caps brought it down to 448V.

I love that G-Flex, but the only reason it's used is because I am too lazy to carry up the Bogner 2X12.
Still enjoy blasting a C+ though the Mesa 4X12 too..... Just don't get to do it that often.
 
Boogiebabies said:
JB,

The recap tightened up the amp a good bit and the bottom end it pretty solid. Not a drastic change.
After the job my plate voltage only went down 2V, so those old caps were still functioning properly.
On old caps, as the ESR or effective series resistance goes up they tend to store, or as I say block more voltage.
I did one on a 60W and the old caps had the plates up to 474V and the amp sounded like a buzz saw and had no bottom end.
New caps brought it down to 448V.

I love that G-Flex, but the only reason it's used is because I am too lazy to carry up the Bogner 2X12.
Still enjoy blasting a C+ though the Mesa 4X12 too..... Just don't get to do it that often.

I know that assumption is the mother of all F-up's, but would an abnormally high plate voltage be a possible sign of capacitor degradation? Something to watch out for?
 
dodger916 said:
Ed did my C+. It was like having a close friend who truly cares do the work. He'd ask me questions about my playing styles, like/dislikes, etc., and recommend possible changes to the stock format, e.g, the bright reduction mod. No slam against Mesa, but would you rather take your car to a big dealership or a local mechanic you've known for years who still gets his hands dirty? Or like a neighborhood tailor versus the department store hack. It felt like personalized service, and I felt involved. Stokes too; he re-capped my Mark IV, and I dropped off the amp so we got to meet. I made two friends who I can now rely on for help or advice. Stokes even contacted me afterwards to make sure all was good.

p.s. I think Ed might be back in upstate NY, so shipping should be cheaper and quicker!

pps Thanks, Ed, for photo tutorial!

Cool, I know what you mean, but doesn't Mike B at Mesa do all the work on the IIC+'s ? I also might have him put a plus sign on mine, it doesn't have one for some reason.
 
Stephan said:
dodger916 said:
Ed did my C+. It was like having a close friend who truly cares do the work. He'd ask me questions about my playing styles, like/dislikes, etc., and recommend possible changes to the stock format, e.g, the bright reduction mod. No slam against Mesa, but would you rather take your car to a big dealership or a local mechanic you've known for years who still gets his hands dirty? Or like a neighborhood tailor versus the department store hack. It felt like personalized service, and I felt involved. Stokes too; he re-capped my Mark IV, and I dropped off the amp so we got to meet. I made two friends who I can now rely on for help or advice. Stokes even contacted me afterwards to make sure all was good.

p.s. I think Ed might be back in upstate NY, so shipping should be cheaper and quicker!

pps Thanks, Ed, for photo tutorial!

Cool, I know what you mean, but doesn't Mike B at Mesa do all the work on the IIC+'s ? I also might have him put a plus sign on mine, it doesn't have one for some reason.

Yes, he does.
 
Stephan said:
stokes said:
Sorry,dont know anybody up that way.I'm in NYC and Fishkill NY,Ed,Boogiebabies is down south.If you're gonna have to ship it,I'd ship it to Ed before Mesa.I dont deal with shipping myself.See if you can find a good tech in your area.

Just curious, why Ed before Mesa?
Ed knows as much,if not more,than anybody about Boogie amps,and specifically the C+,including anyone at Mesa.Shipping,even if he was still down south would be less costly than back to Cal.
Ed,I wasnt aware you were back in NY.Whereabouts?
Thanks for the nod,Frank.
 
Boogiebabies said:
dodger916 said:
Ed did my C+. It was like having a close friend who truly cares do the work. He'd ask me questions about my playing styles, like/dislikes, etc., and recommend possible changes to the stock format, e.g, the bright reduction mod. No slam against Mesa, but would you rather take your car to a big dealership or a local mechanic you've known for years who still gets his hands dirty? Or like a neighborhood tailor versus the department store hack. It felt like personalized service, and I felt involved. Stokes too; he re-capped my Mark IV, and I dropped off the amp so we got to meet. I made two friends who I can now rely on for help or advice. Stokes even contacted me afterwards to make sure all was good.

p.s. I think Ed might be back in upstate NY, so shipping should be cheaper and quicker!

pps Thanks, Ed, for photo tutorial!

You're lucky you got that amp back Frank !!!! I am back upstate and need to schedule visitation with my
long lost Export...... Damn, at least you willed it to me.

Yea, and I just changed my will and noticed I have your old N.C. address, so you'll need to PM me your updated, New York contact info! You're welcome ANYTIME. I do make trips down to the Catskills, especially this time of year, and I'd be happy to put her in the car for a visit to Papa! Maybe a side-by-side with your newly-capped lady??
 
stokes said:
Stephan said:
stokes said:
Sorry,dont know anybody up that way.I'm in NYC and Fishkill NY,Ed,Boogiebabies is down south.If you're gonna have to ship it,I'd ship it to Ed before Mesa.I dont deal with shipping myself.See if you can find a good tech in your area.

Just curious, why Ed before Mesa?
Ed knows as much,if not more,than anybody about Boogie amps,and specifically the C+,including anyone at Mesa.Shipping,even if he was still down south would be less costly than back to Cal.
Ed,I wasnt aware you were back in NY.Whereabouts?
Thanks for the nod,Frank.

+1 on all counts.

Stephan: There is nobody I would trust more with my C+ than Ed.

Stokes: you're very welcome!
 
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