FRUSTRATION with Lone Star Special. Need advice please.

[BlueBones]

LSS owners...I've had this amp for a little while now...long enough to do quite a bit of experimenting, and here's the deal: I quickly fell in love with the cleans on channel one - Just spectacular, and maybe the best I ever heard. It took about 1 minute to tweak that channel for blissful cleans. So far, so good, BUT....

Channel 2's mid and high gain tones sucked. They were useless. I've tried 3 different guitars (bucker, P90, and fat single pups) and all manner of different settings and couldn't dial in a good lead tone....No mojo, no harmonics, kind of mucky, way too warm and absolutely NO TEETH to it. So, I finally try the optional (35 watt max) speaker jack and, presto! Much better gainy tones in Ch 2. Not spectacular like the cleans, but useable at least.

So I figured there is hope for me keeping this amp...Then I switch to channel one, still using the optional speaker jack, and the clean tone sucks there! Very thin, harsh and strident, and it apparently can't be dialed out.

Obviously, those speaker jacks aren't footswitchable! So as a two channel amp, if I can't use both of them, I'm not keeping an expensive amp like this.

I noticed mine has a Black Shadow speaker and not a C-90 like most of LSSs. I dont know if that matters or not. And I have good JJ tubes in there now.

Any advice that will keep me from putting this ***** up on Ebay?

Thanks in advance

 

[bcbooya]

I've only had the amp for a couple of months now, so I'm still learning it's nuances as well. I know what you mean about the drive channel, though. It just seems kind of dark and compressed (by design?). Here's some of what I've found...

Where are you leaving the presence control at? I find myself leaving that control higher than what the manual suggests... nearly at 3 oclock. It also seems to me that turning up the gain beyond 2-3 oclock gives me a darker, more compressed sound. I think the manual mentions this as well. It also says that if you turn up the drive higher than the gain you'll get a brighter, but thinner, sound.

I think volume levels play a big role in this amp, as well. I find that at bedroom levels I have my treble and presence set higher than when I'm jamming along with the band. The amp seems to open up for me once I turn it up beyond 9 oclock.

That being said, to get a really singing, sustained lead tone (ala Gilmour) I slam the front end with a rangemaster-clone (beano boost from retroman).

Anyway, lemme know if you find anything!

 

[ned]

What kind of tone are you trying to get? Crunch ala Recto or a Plexi type tone or smooth Vox like tones?

 

[Gerin]

I also have the LSS and for Cleans it is amazing, then add the 5 watt mode and it is almost like sex.

Now as you have said the 2nd channel is lacking. If your like me and wanted ripping Recto style distortion then of course it is lacking. It is after all a Class A amp known to lack all notice of super distortion. I do find it has great tone for layed back melodic soloing and do use it for such.

However as I stated that for me at least I wanted super distortion I decided to also purchase a Recto head. Now I just run into a simple a/b switch and for cleans and slower more melodic solo work I go to the LSS. For the heavy distortion I go over to the Rectifier.

Sure this is a very expensive fix however it has to be one of the best combinations of amps I have ever owned or will ever own.

I use an slightly older ESP Horizon Custom, about 15 years old. It has SD Pearly Gates in the bridge position and classic 59's in the neck. With it I find the 2nd channel on the LSS to be very open sounding. Sorry not much for speaking about how it sounds. Either way I would not be pleased with the 2nd channel since I bought the amp only for the cleans.

 

[LSCMan]

Get a pedal and forget about the lead channel, altogether. :evil:

 

[BlueBones]

I've only had the amp for a couple of months now, so I'm still learning it's nuances as well. I know what you mean about the drive channel, though. It just seems kind of dark and compressed (by design?). Here's some of what I've found...

Where are you leaving the presence control at? I find myself leaving that control higher than what the manual suggests... nearly at 3 oclock. It also seems to me that turning up the gain beyond 2-3 oclock gives me a darker, more compressed sound. I think the manual mentions this as well. It also says that if you turn up the drive higher than the gain you'll get a brighter, but thinner, sound.

I think volume levels play a big role in this amp, as well. I find that at bedroom levels I have my treble and presence set higher than when I'm jamming along with the band. The amp seems to open up for me once I turn it up beyond 9 oclock.

That being said, to get a really singing, sustained lead tone (ala Gilmour) I slam the front end with a rangemaster-clone (beano boost from retroman).

Anyway, lemme know if you find anything!

Thanks. I've been running it at low volumes with the presence at about 10:00 and the treble at 1:00. I did just try them quite a bit higher and that helps on Ch. 2...still not what I'd call good tone. And you are rght about volume most of all - Seems the thing doesn't open up on Ch. 2 until the master's at 12:00 or higher, and maybe I've been picking too tentatively while playing it in "test mode" if you know what I mean.

Last night, along with using higher volume, I'm making a conscious effort to really dig in with the pick, and the tone changes dramatically for the better - More attack, some nastiness and pretty nice harmonic overtones. Not quite satisfied yet, but maybe there is still hope. I'm having more trouble getting lead tones. Crucnchy rythm stuff is okay.

Its **** loud, but best tone so far with the following Ch.2 settings here:

Drive engaged / drive set at 2:00
Voice switched to "thick"
Gain at 3:00
Treble at 1:00
Mid at 10:00
Bass at 10:00
Presence at 11:00
Master at 1:00 (effects loop off)

Playing a G&L Comanche through it.

 

[BlueBones]

What kind of tone are you trying to get? Crunch ala Recto or a Plexi type tone or smooth Vox like tones?

I wouldnt expect Recto tones from this thing. I play Blues and Blues Rock type stuff mostly, but I don't like the same old early break-up blues stuff. I liked the idea of this amp because it is supposed to have heftier gain available than a Peavey Classic 30 or the like. It does, but the tone ain't there or I've not found it yet. I'm mostly having trouble getting a rich, singing sustain lead tone.

 

[BlueBones]

I also have the LSS and for Cleans it is amazing, then add the 5 watt mode and it is almost like sex.

Now as you have said the 2nd channel is lacking. If your like me and wanted ripping Recto style distortion then of course it is lacking. It is after all a Class A amp known to lack all notice of super distortion. I do find it has great tone for layed back melodic soloing and do use it for such.

However as I stated that for me at least I wanted super distortion I decided to also purchase a Recto head. Now I just run into a simple a/b switch and for cleans and slower more melodic solo work I go to the LSS. For the heavy distortion I go over to the Rectifier.

Sure this is a very expensive fix however it has to be one of the best combinations of amps I have ever owned or will ever own.

I use an slightly older ESP Horizon Custom, about 15 years old. It has SD Pearly Gates in the bridge position and classic 59's in the neck. With it I find the 2nd channel on the LSS to be very open sounding. Sorry not much for speaking about how it sounds. Either way I would not be pleased with the 2nd channel since I bought the amp only for the cleans.

Thanks. Yeah, maybe its simply voiced too mellow for what I want out of it. I like warm, mellow tones too, but I'd like it to some nastiness available too. Your solution is too expensive for me. )
For a hack like me, this amp needs to sound very good on both channels to be a keeper. I'll keep tweaking though...I have gotten closer, and maybe was expecting too much from it at lower volumes.

 

[BlueBones]

Get a pedal and forget about the lead channel, altogether. :evil:

I would, but I paid a lot for that second channel and I don't like using pedals for the most part.

 

[ctoddrun]

Yeah. Using a pedal to get distortion on a Boogie seems like a fools errand.

When I dumped my rack gear to go back to pedals, I was interested in that Boss GT-6 (I think?), but since they dedicated so much of the pedal to distortion modeling, I passed.

I guess they expect you to run that thing through some solid state amp set as clean as possible and use the "oh so glorious" Boss distortion tones.

No thanks.

That new TC Electronics all in one pedal has my interest piqued though, I will admit.

 

[Surfcaster]

Hey Bluebones,

I agree with you, that's way too much money to spend if it's not what you're looking for. Granted, some people will drop $1500 or more for a single channel amp, and if that's what you're looking for, great (if I had the cash I'd spend that on a Dr. Z in a heartbeat).

Have you tried an F-50? I play rock and blues and some jazz and while the F-50 isn't the perfect amp, it covers these very nicely, IMHO at least. My biggest complaint with the tone is that it isn't warm enough...so if you think the LSS is too warm, maybe the F-50 is more what you're looking for. It doesn't have all the bells and whistles of the LSS, but it's also a few hundred $$ less. It'd probably be worth trying one out, at least. It also has a very nice clean channel...probably Mesa's best at the time. I've not played the LS or LSS, so I don't know how it compares, but I'm very happy with it.

Personally, I'm having an 18W plexi style amp built for me for my warmer vintage tones (from a guy who's pretty new to amp building, so it's very reasonably priced). But I'll hang onto the F50 for my higher gain needs. Even if I wasn't getting this amp, I'd still keep my F50...I've not found anything better for the money...even among amps selling for hundreds more.

 

[DoTheDo]

Get a TS9 or 808 to bring the dirty channel over the top.

 

[cnumb44]

Have you tried a Classic?

That's what I have and I find I can get both channels to give good tones through the 6L6s. Of course, it is all a matter of personal preference. What I think is a good tone some others may think sucks. Then again, it just might be my playing that sucks!

I think the Black Shdow speaker is also brighter, so you might want to experiment there.

 

[Ducky]

And I have good JJ tubes in there now.

Sorry for highjacking the thread, but i have a LSS aswell. I have the same comments about the mids on ch2 (the Highs i don't mind)

But my questions is about your JJ's. What do you think vs Stock? (other than your problems with ch2 )

 

[Lone Star State]

Man, I'm not trying to bag on anyone here, but the LSS is absolutely the wrong amp for what you want. It's simply designed for a different tone.
There's nothing wrong with the amp, it was your choice that was faulty.
It's like choosing penicillin to treat a severed artery. That's not what it was designed for.

 

[SabuJSE]

Let me also add to the above: What's wrong with using an OD pedal?

Hell, I have a Pod XTL in the effect loops and with some of the stomps in there - most noticably, the Fuzz PI stomp - I can get 4 glorious tones out of Channel 1, Ch 1 + Stomp, Channel 2, Ch 2 + Stomp. Clean, Blues Overdrive, Crunch, Dripping Distortion.

I love these all in one floor units. Toss all my pedals, have everything I need in one, designed to be like the pedals I just tossed.

 

[GenoBluzGtr]

It's my experience that those are the qualities of the EL-84 sound.

I tried a LSS when the local store got one, and immediately noticed that character. It's simply that the amp is designed to sound that way.

The cleans are Awesome (as are most EL-84 amps), but if you don't desire that ragged, dirty, gritty drive, it's not the amp for you.

Sounds like you really prefer the 6L6 or 6V6 tone. I know I do.

 

[LSCMan]

A good Analogman or Keeley Bluesdriver would be a whole lot thriftier than selling your amp on eBay and buying something else.

You get the clean bite with the dirt on top, it sounds awesome.

 

[SabuJSE]

Something I read recently in an interview with Eric Johnson ultimately sealed the deal for me with the LSS. To paraphrase:

A great overall tone starts with a great clean tone.

 

[axwielding1]

That's absolutely correct.. A great, full clean is the basis of good tone. You then can use channel 2 for a revved up rhythm, and clean channel with an OD for leads... I tried the LSS many times, and even brought in my modded TS9. I got 3 great channels, plus with guitar volume, many "old school" possibilities....
Sounds to me like the original author should have bought the classic, or F30/50......
I'd still take the LSS...........
ax. :twisted: