Dual Caliber lead channel?

[LEVEL4]

For a lead sound you will probably still like the DC-3 as far as a metal rhythm sound I could never get enough bottom out of mine . . .

Thanks for your comments—much appreciated! I bought a used Single-Recto Solo 50 to take care of "the bottom." No matter how much I demo a Mark IV, and how I tweak my DC-3, I'm always left wanting that Recto THUD. So I bought one. Problem solved. Now, my dilemma is wondering if there's going to be too much overlap from the Mark IV with my DC-3. A Mark IV is going to cost me about as much as a Soldano, which I was fully planning to buy before all this Mesa madness afflicted me. I can't buy a Mark IV AND a Soldano. This is getting nuts!

 

[Monsta-Tone]

:lol: OK, now I gotta chime in here. :lol:


I had 2 Mark IV's. Version A & Version B. I liked them a lot, but found R2 just didn't suit me at all. In fact, R2 is one of the main reasons I sold both of them.

I had, at the same time, Mark IV A, DC-3, DC-5, & a DC-10.

I A/B'd the Mark IV with the DC-10, since they were about the same power ratings.

Mark IV: Too tight and too much going on. It seemed like the amp would change character overnight. What sounded great one day, sounded like *** the next. I would leave all the knobs in the same place and the amp would not move ( maybe it got up to get a drink in the middle of the night ). I would use the same cords and guitar. The tone would change.
I found that when I used it with my band, I could never get the tones I was looking for. I spent all of our breaks trying to dial it in.

DC-10: Incredibly loud and just sweet no matter where the knobs are placed. It is a very consistent amp and I am able to get the tones I am looking for no matter what room or what guitar/cord I am using. It is very easy to dial in as well. Money is tight right now, and I almost sold it. Thanks Fdesalvo for talking me into keeping it! :lol:

DC-3: Has really good cleans, with lots of chime. The distortion tones are unlike most of the Boogies that I've had (lots of them) because of the EL-84's. It cuts through the mix very well, especially if you add a Thiele under it. I just sold mine to Glauco because I needed to raise some money, otherwise, I would have kept it forever.



I think in the end, after the honeymoon period is over with the Mark IV, you will sell the Mark and keep the DC-3.


If it were me, I would get a Soldano Lucky 13 instead of the Mark. They do not have as much gain as the SLO from the factory, but I have some mods that will set them free. Plus, the cleans are incredible and the Reverb is really nice too.


The Mark IV is the be-all end-all amp for a lot of guys. Mostly for guys who like to tweak their amps to perfection. I'm looking for amps that I don't have to spend time tweaking so I can spend time playing them.
To me, it seemed like it did a lot of stuff, but only did a few things extremely well.


Get an EV Thiele for your DC-3 and you will never think you need bottom end again.

 

[edward]

Side note: I have yet to hear an amp of any make that didn't sound better when I plugged my EVM-Thiele into it. It is a superb addition to any tonehound, IMHO.

Edward

 

[Ken j]

Hmmm interesting, Ken. So these "sales numbers" are from Mesa themselves??

Keep in mind this was a few years ago and now the Mark and other Mesa models are still in production. I wonder if it is still a record today. It would be interesting to see actual build number for each model, for every year.

In the later years I ran my DC-5 combo with a 1 X 12" 3/4 back cab. I always wanted to try an EV Theile but never had the opportunity. I still have the 3/4 back and use it with the Subway Blues and a Fender Blues Jr.

 

[LEVEL4]

OK, now I gotta chime in here . . . If it were me, I would get a Soldano Lucky 13 instead of the Mark. They do not have as much gain as the SLO from the factory, but I have some mods that will set them free. Plus, the cleans are incredible and the Reverb is really nice too.

Monsta: Thanks for that detailed post! Will comment in a new thread . . .

 

[MarkofXlnts]

I saw the DC thread and had to chime in, I absolutely love my DC-2 and it is my go-to amplifier. Like many others here, I run it with the Thiele if I need more low end and sound dispersion. The DC-2 lacks the GEQ of the other models, but I find it to be perfect for my needs. Someone in a previous post compared the DC series to the F-series, and I have to agree, based on what I have heard I prefer the DC amps. I tried an F-30 and an F-50 and still prefer my DC-2. Sometimes I wish I would have waited and purchased a DC-3 for the extra power and GEQ, but I could not pass up the DC-2 (dead-mint condition with switch, manual, and matching Thiele for $700).

As far as sound goes, I think the clean channel is very sparkly and crisp. In my opinion the lead channel sounds more like a Mark amp than anything else (with the Contour switch off). I currently have a Mark I, and used to own a Mark III red-stripe, and I think the DC is closest to the Mark amps in lead channel voicing. Not exact, but a similar flavor. I have not tried the new Express amps yet, does anyone know how the DC series compares to the Express line?

 

[LEVEL4]

As far as sound goes, I think the clean channel is very sparkly and crisp. In my opinion the lead channel sounds more like a Mark amp than anything else (with the Contour switch off).

Haven't tried the Express amps, but with no GEQ, I wasn't interested. I think my DC-3's lead channel sounds like a Mark's lead channel, except with a big, comfy blanket over the it, and its gain at only about '2.' Maybe there's something wrong with my DC-3? Its clean channel sounds great, but I never play cleans on my electrics. When I want cleans, I use my acoustic through a preamp and a DI.

 

[LEVEL4]

Okay, I just layed down some lead tracks using my DC-3's lead channel. It's daytime now, so, I was able to crank the amp a bit more. I have to admit, it sounded pretty sweet. Dark. But nice. I was able to pull of some nice pinch-harmonics that snarled just the right way. Certainly NOT ice-pickey. The DC-3 actually has "enough" treble and presence, when recorded, it just sounds flat when listening to it live. That seems to be true in general with all my amps, especially the Mark IV and my 6505. Wherever I happen to dial in my treble and presence to record, I always end up having to back it off, and re-track, because resulting recording ends up too treble-ey.

[some time passes . . . ]

Okay, so now I lay down some more lead tracks with the DC-3. Although it sounds kinda dull to my ears (too bass-ey, too midrange-ey), when recorded, the amp sounds great. More apparent treble is recorded than I hear in the room ('course, I'm using very bright mics). It's got a lot of tone, and there's no shrillyness that's sometimes difficult to dial out of the Mark IV. I'm having a whole new opinion on my DC-3 now. I don't think I'd be happy if it were my only amp, but for leads, it actually seems to pwn my Mark IV for tone. Two days ago, I was ready to Ebay the **** outta my DC-3. Now, I can't believe the lead tones coming from this thing. Funny about amps, huh?

I think in the end, after the honeymoon period is over with the Mark IV, you will sell the Mark and keep the DC-3.

When you first wrote this, I thought you were crazy. Now that I've had my Mark IV for a few days now, I think I'm getting to see what you meant. I was so ready to Ebay the crap outta my DC-3 right after getting my Mark IV home. I was like, "****, NOW what am I gonna do with this 'crappy' DC-3?" But while the Mark IV is really fun, it's the DC-3 I've been coming back to record my leads with. Funny how amps are . . .

[even more time passes . . . ]

Holy ****! Now, I can't believe I was going to sell this amp! It's so different from the Mark IV. Now, I layed down some low-toned rhythms. This amp has some really cool sounds. It's no Recto. It's no Mark. But what it does is really amazing. Low and growly. At first, you think, "There's nowhere near enough gain in this thing!" But, it's a different kind of gain. Once you "find" its sounds, you love 'em. Again, I don't think I could have it as my only amp, but it's a terrific complement to the rest of the Mesa line. I think I've finally discovered what all the other DC-lovers here have found about this amp.

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I think I've finally discovered what all the other DC-lovers here have found about this amp.

Sometimes the red-headed step child grows up to be a super model! :lol:


This same thing happened to me. I bought the Mark IV A and put all my other amps aside. I even sold my Heartbreaker and DC-5. Then, one day, I started playing the DC-10 again and was blown away.

Long story short, I sold the Mark, kept the DC-10 and eventually got another Heartbreaker.

I don't believe in the Swiss Army Knife amp idea. I think the Mark IV does a few things extremely well and a lot of things fairly well. It simply wasn't the amp for me.

 

[tetsubin]

I dug out an old review of the DC-5 Combo (Guitar Magazine, December 1993 (UK)). Just a few quotes:

"You know you're using a valve combo: there's a crisp and lively punchiness, a pleasing warmth and a good tone."

"[...] this is a much more rock-oriented beast than, say, a Boogie MkIV, with fatter sounds, more extremes of tonal range, and some pretty uncouth (but useful) overdrive settings."

"By skillful knob-twiddling you can get a wide variety of guitar sounds, with choice over compression characteristics"

The "lead channel lends a soft sort of attack to individual notes - presumably in imitation of the Dual Rectifier's spongy/valve-rectifier sounds - yet there's still plenty of sustain and definition."

They also have a few quotes from Randall Smith in the article, who talks a bit about the design with two totally separate channels, not just gainstages switched in and out. And he mentions the distinctiveness of the rhythm channel's midrange control, which delivers at 3 what other Boogies deliver at 10. "Set it to 0 for modern shimmer, 2 for Fender Blackface, or 8 for the threshold of distortion."

 

[fdesalvo]

I love you all.

 

[fdesalvo]

LEVEL4,

How would you compare the DC3 to the SR50?

 

[LEVEL4]

LEVEL4,

How would you compare the DC3 to the SR50?

Sorry for the late reply—I have weird sleeping habits. I've been able to A/B my DC-3 to both my Single-Recto Solo 50, and my Mark IV, very easily now.

• DC-3 doesn't sound ANYTHING like a Recto.
• DC-3 sounds a lot more like a Mark IV, but with only, perhaps, 70% of the audible treble, presence, and gain.
• I can make my Mark IV sound ALMOST exactly like my DC-3, but not vice-versa.

If you want a Recto sound, only a Recto can reproduce it (from the Mesa line). To me, Framus Cobras sound almost exactly like Rectos, but Rectos are much less expensive.

Wait a second . . . you said, "compare," right? Well, I think of the Recto as a one-trick-pony (at least for my needs). I use it for what it does best . . . BIG HEAVY CHORDS! I don't use the Recto at all for leads (and, never planned or expected to). I really bought the Recto just for that ONE sound, since I CAN'T make that sound on my Mark IV. I use the DC-3 for leads. The DC-3 is my go-to, lead-making machine.