Boogie Book.

[Nomad]

OK there are a couple of Marshall Amp books and several books on Fenders out there.

How come no one has ever done a Boogie Book?

Or is there one out there I dont know about?

 

[jerseydrew]

Good question. I'm curious too.

 

[Xqzdust]

Very simple answer. When you've got a Boogie who wants to stop playing long enough to write a book?

 

[jvk]

Well said, Xqzdust. I'm gonna stop playing my Boogie long enough to type this...

Fender started building amps in the 1940s, and in the 50s they invented the first solid-body electric guitar, which became the Telecaster. In the early 60s Marshall started out by jacking the design of the '59 Fender Bassman. Boogie started out hotrodding Fender Princetons in 1967. The Mark series also "borrowed" heavily from others (notably Fender) but ended up being a legend on its own. Then with the Recto, guitar players received more "borrowed" circuitry, this time from Soldano, which have taken the modern music world by storm.

Leo Fender was a true legend and pioneer, and deserves and receives his fair share of the spotlight in literature for his company. Every single guitar tube amp can trace it's lineage in some way or other back to Fender, and will use some of the innovation they created. Jim Marshall started out as a thief and then turned poet with the rest of his company's creations (my beloved jcm800 2210 for one). Randall Smith started out a thief and turned poet with the Marks and then back to thief again with the Rectifiers!

What I want to say is that Boogie has been paramount in the development of the guitar in modern music, from Santana and Rolling Stones to Metallica and DT. But can you really compare the number of classic songs / riffs made using Marshalls, Vox, and Fenders to Boogies? Don't think so. It doesn't make Boogies any lesser than it's predecessors though. I really respect Mike B and R. Smith for the circuitry and tone of the Mark series. Each one of these companies deserves it's respective place in the history of Tone.

I'd love to see a book on Boogies. I'd buy it.

 

[bpm91]

Someone in one of the big threads was mentioning penning a book and planning to have it out this holiday season.... But I don't know much else.

 

[mrd]

I'd be willing to write a book just on the freakin' Road King and how many crazy tones you can get out of it. :lol:

 

[scottywompas]

I'd love to see a book on boogies. I know there is a ton of info on the web but I'd love to have and actual book.

Scott

 

[Xqzdust]

JVK What you said! I agree with your comments. Without Leo we might all being playing accordian! Seriously though, he took basic circuits from radio amps and improved them so he was a theif also. It is the nature of all creativity to take someone else's work and personalize it. Eric stole from Robert and Stevie Ray stole from Jimi and I steal from both and yet remain very empty handed!

Still a good comprehensive book that covers all the variations and mods of all the Mesa products would be st the top of my shopping list. Of course it might well cut the traffic on this website down to minimal levels if no one had those topics to argue about! LOL

 

[Boogiebabies]

Someone in one of the big threads was mentioning penning a book and planning to have it out this holiday season.... But I don't know much else.

That was a joke. It was just the IIC+ manifesto.

 

[bpm91]

Someone in one of the big threads was mentioning penning a book and planning to have it out this holiday season.... But I don't know much else.

That was a joke. It was just the IIC+ manifesto.

I thought it was to cover more than just the C+. Oh well, twas a good idea.

 

[Nomad]

Well lets have it. Im not much of a writer but I sure would like to see one. Something that is really in depth and goes into a lot of detail about all the different models and versions of amps. Lots of pictures too.

 

[ramalam]

Well said, Xqzdust. I'm gonna stop playing my Boogie long enough to type this...

Fender started building amps in the 1940s, and in the 50s they invented the first solid-body electric guitar, which became the Telecaster. In the early 60s Marshall started out by jacking the design of the '59 Fender Bassman. Boogie started out hotrodding Fender Princetons in 1967. The Mark series also "borrowed" heavily from others (notably Fender) but ended up being a legend on its own. Then with the Recto, guitar players received more "borrowed" circuitry, this time from Soldano, which have taken the modern music world by storm.

Leo Fender was a true legend and pioneer, and deserves and receives his fair share of the spotlight in literature for his company. Every single guitar tube amp can trace it's lineage in some way or other back to Fender, and will use some of the innovation they created. Jim Marshall started out as a thief and then turned poet with the rest of his company's creations (my beloved jcm800 2210 for one). Randall Smith started out a thief and turned poet with the Marks and then back to thief again with the Rectifiers!

What I want to say is that Boogie has been paramount in the development of the guitar in modern music, from Santana and Rolling Stones to Metallica and DT. But can you really compare the number of classic songs / riffs made using Marshalls, Vox, and Fenders to Boogies? Don't think so. It doesn't make Boogies any lesser than it's predecessors though. I really respect Mike B and R. Smith for the circuitry and tone of the Mark series. Each one of these companies deserves it's respective place in the history of Tone.

I'd love to see a book on Boogies. I'd buy it.

You are using the word thief much too loosely. Leo Fender didn't come up with those circuits without the help of the early amplifier circuits put out by the big electronics companies. All of the amp builders have borrowed from those original amp circuits. Not to take away a thing from Fender but most of his designs are very similar. Smith has a long list of very different and innovative circuits and features. As far as innovation goes, Smith has to be at or very close to the top of the list.

 

[jvk]

I agree that Leo was also a thief as well as a pirate. They all were. I use "theif" in a tongue in cheek way, I cannibalise stuff all the time. That's how I've learnt most of what I know in life, by immitation and adapting those ideas

The "novelty in the arts" (to use a Patent Office term) of RCS's inventions can be discussed until the cows come, a couple are truly innovative (multiple cascading gain stages) and some are inspired by old designs which he made practical (simulclass) and some are plain silly (patenting a switch for changing between tube rectifier and sillicon diodes). His unity gain GEQ circuit is borrowed from hifi/mixing desk tenchnology at the time (I found a very similar circuit in an old electronics magazine). I loved his idea for the Triaxis; the marriage of modern and the old - using microprocessors to control tube circuits. RCS is a prolific designer, one of my favourite in. I know more about his work than that of Leo's. I imagine Leo Fender as the Hendrix of the times, and RCS as Clapton Leo Fender was an innovator not just of tone, but in instrument design as well, and all during the Golden Era of rock music, along people like Les Paul.

 

[jvk]

If he wants to act like the corporate butt-pirate in his business dealings, he should dress and talk the part.

:lol:

 

[ramalam]

I have seen these Randall Smith criticisms raised on other boards many times. When I hold their feet to the fire, no one ever had specifics that can be checked verified, only hearsay.

If you apply and qualify for a patent, first, its yours. I don't want to hear the sour grapes. If you don't have the patent, you either didn't have a qualifying design or were to lazy to go through all the trouble, and it is a lot of trouble. I have been through the design, non disclosure, research and patent search portions of the process.

These guys should get their facts straight and give credit where credit is due. Just the innovation of having a tiny little but full featured package that could hold its own against a 100 watt Marshall full stack should give them a clue. How about being responsible for at least 3 or so very distinctive, never heard before and still incredibly successful sounds. That would give most reasonable people a clue and that is just for starters.

 

[jvk]

I have seen these Randall Smith criticisms raised on other boards many times. When I hold their feet to the fire, no one ever had specifics that can be checked verified, only hearsay.

If you apply and qualify for a patent, first, its yours. I don't want to hear the sour grapes. If you don't have the patent, you either didn't have a qualifying design or were to lazy to go through all the trouble, and it is a lot of trouble. I have been through the design, non disclosure, research and patent search portions of the process.

These guys should get their facts straight and give credit where credit is due. Just the innovation of having a tiny little but full featured package that could hold its own against a 100 watt Marshall full stack should give them a clue. How about being responsible for at least 3 or so very distinctive, never heard before and still incredibly successful sounds. That would give most reasonable people a clue and that is just for starters.

ramalam, "The sour grapes" like it or not are part of human discussion, and an essence of online forums if you will, there are people who'll always be unhappy, and take things a little too seriously.

I'm not merely regurgitation what I've heard, my specifics are facts and as an engineer and designer I've studied Boogie schematics and patents to death. I also believe that credit should be given when it's due, like RCS should do with Soldano

 

[ramalam]

I am fine with anyone who has legitimate criticism...no problem. It is just those who mindlessly repeat inaccurate rumors. I have no problem with giving Soldano Credit for whatever he has accomplished either but in the world we are living in, right or wrong, if you didn't get the patent, for whatever reason, you don't get credit for it. I don't know if Mr. Soldano is going around complaining or not but that would be his problem. For Mr. Soldano and anyone a similar situation, there are rules in patent law and they should be understood and adhered to by all. This is nothing new and the norm in doing business. If you think the amp builders have it bad, they have nothing to complain about compared to many, many other businesses.

 

[Nomad]

OK this is sorta kinda getting off the topic.

So I'll stick my 2 cents in anway. :lol:

Lets see. First off Leo Fender didnt thieve anything. Those 30's and 40's circuit designs were shared to anyone who could/ would take them and expand them. That was the idea back then. Here take these can you do something with em?

Second off Jim Marshall followed along those same lines because of a need not a rip off. Back then that was a Major deal to import a very exsepnsive higly exotic guitar amp. Today we take this kind of thing for granted.

Third off who's circuits did Soldano borrow from? Cranked Marshall?

Fourth off concerning Randal Smith. In this day and age if you dont get a Patent on it someone else will and you will be left out in the cold. Thats just the way it is. I attribute RS being a savy business man concerning all the patents.

Fith off if someone who designed somthing wasnt savy enuff to Patent it that is their problem not Randals. Critising Randal for keeping his butt from being chilled by the cold cold wind is pointless.

I have seen all sorts of stuff being tossed around on the net about it but havent once seen an offer of actual evidence to support any claims that he actually ripped someone off.

If the property next to mine is for sale at a crazy good deal and someone else comes along and buys it how can I be upset with them because I didnt have the wisdom to buy it myself?

That being said lets get back to it. Where's my Boogie Book?

 

[sjones]

If you apply and qualify for a patent, first, its yours. I don't want to hear the sour grapes. If you don't have the patent, you either didn't have a qualifying design or were to lazy to go through all the trouble, and it is a lot of trouble. I have been through the design, non disclosure, research and patent search portions of the process.

heard somewhere that Gene Simmons patented calling orange juice "OJ" when he found out no one had ever done so...

also read somewhere that Yamaha hired Mike Soldano to design the T-50/T-100 (great amps by the way) to compete with Boogie...I think it was on the internet and they wouldn't print it if it wasn't true... :roll:

back to the topic - I'd buy the book too

 

[xarkon]

So here's a question (from someone who can write, plays guitar, and understands amplifier electronics):

How many Mesa amps have been produced?

The answer to that question is a significant factor in the commercial viability of a book.

Dave