Anyone have an older JP2C to compare to newer built with the Shumacker transformers?

[bandit2013]

I am just asking out of curiosity. How different does the 2021-2024 JP2Cs sound compared to the 2016-2020 model years that have different transformers?

If it is that different in character, perhaps the STR443 tubes are the way to go. The amps that predate the transformer manufacturer change may be much better with the STR445 or STR448 power tubes. I can also claim the STR415 are gold in the JP2C (2016). Not sure how to relate to any changes made after the first production runs.

It seems the JP2C trend has sort of dropped off much like the activity in the Rectifier section. Mark V still going.

 

[soloistthree]

I am just asking out of curiosity. How different does the 2021-2024 JP2Cs sound compared to the 2016-2020 model years that have different transformers?

If it is that different in character, perhaps the STR443 tubes are the way to go. The amps that predate the transformer manufacturer change may be much better with the STR445 or STR448 power tubes. I can also claim the STR415 are gold in the JP2C (2016). Not sure how to relate to any changes made after the first production runs.

It seems the JP2C trend has sort of dropped off much like the activity in the Rectifier section. Mark V still going.

I too am interested in this as I've found my new JP2C to be quite buzzy compared to my Mark VII, wondering if the older model had less "fizz"; really wish my JP2C sounded like my Mark VII (in Mark IIC+ and IV modes), that thing is just the perfect balance of nice top-end and punchy lows

 

[bandit2013]

I can relate. The STR440 tubes did have a pissed off hornets nest sound to them. It was not all that bad really. When I tried the STR443 tubes, that buzz or fizz was gone but so was the power tube saturation. Too much low end not much in terms of mid or upper frequency character unless I pushed the amp at gig level.

Mine was made in 2016.

There are three power tube options for the JP2C other than the STR443. Not sure what the effect will be with the different transformers. However, I have experimented with the STR448 in a grey bias color. Those were good. Not fizzy and had more balance on top and bottom frequencies. The STR445 (same 6L6 tubes used in the Mark VII as stock tube) is good too. Much better than I thought they would sound. Then if you must have that Old school IIC+ sound that the Mark VII cannot deliver, it will cost $550 for the full quad. NOS STR415 (Sylvania 6L6GC) direct from the Mesa stash they have on reserve. I think when they are spent, I may use the STR445 (green bias color). I found the greens to be too "early gain" type for the Mark VII as it did not perform well with those tubes at gig level. The yellow bias color range was a better fit for the Mark VII. Just note that the NOS tubes will have a slightly thinner pin than the current production. The STR445 tubes are very tight to get into the sockets but will work in the JP. The Mark V90, the STR445 tubes are not a good fit (performance wise), just did not sound great, at least with the V90 I have.

 

[GJgo]

I've had both a very early JP2C as well as a recent one with the new iron, though not at the same time. Take it with a grain of salt but I did feel like the new one had better tone. The old one was a little more squished and had pretty bad feedback under high gain.

The old one- (audio quality isn't great but it's what I've got)


The new one in the room-


The new one close mic-

 

[bandit2013]

I know you have all the tubes. What did you have in the JP2C? STR440, STR443, STR415? If other just say other. Just curious.

 

[GJgo]

The early one came stock with 440s and the later one came stock with 443s. I did do this test just playing live. however as time went on & I got into reamping & testing using reamps where you can change literally just one thing at a time and close mic record in a controlled setup, I've come to the conclusion that for recording, tubes don't matter so long as they are in good condition. In the room is of course another story & still up for debate.

 

[soloistthree]

The early one came stock with 440s and the later one came stock with 443s. I did do this test just playing live. however as time went on & I got into reamping & testing using reamps where you can change literally just one thing at a time and close mic record in a controlled setup, I've come to the conclusion that for recording, tubes don't matter so long as they are in good condition. In the room is of course another story & still up for debate.

I'm definitely one of those guys too, as long as they aren't malfunctioning, they are negligible. And these days, too much money to throw out to get a meaningful change. My JP2C definitely has a buzzy quality to it, compared to my III and Mark VII, I can kill it with the 6.6khz slider but then the whole amp is too dark

 

[Darkstar2]

My 2022-built JP2C also came from the factory with some 'buzz saw/ice pick' quality to the top end. Two things seemed to mitigate that -- really breaking in the power tubes (100+ hours of playtime) and swapping the preamp tubes from stock JJs to ANOS 50s and 60s 12AX7s (RCA, GE, Sylvania ect.). I was also running the amp through a very new vertical 2x12, so I think those speakers were a bit green.

 

[GJgo]

My 2022-built JP2C also came from the factory with some 'buzz saw/ice pick' quality to the top end. Two things seemed to mitigate that -- really breaking in the power tubes (100+ hours of playtime) and swapping the preamp tubes from stock JJs to ANOS 50s and 60s 12AX7s (RCA, GE, Sylvania ect.). I was also running the amp through a very new vertical 2x12, so I think those speakers were a bit green.

Most likely that's the speakers. V30s from around 2005 through around 2019 are harsh & fizzy. Find you an older set from 2003 or earlier & prepare to be amazed.

Plus, the 16 ohm speakers in the 2x12s are generally more top endy & cutting than the 8 ohm version which are smoother.

 

[soloistthree]

Most likely that's the speakers. V30s from around 2005 through around 2019 are harsh & fizzy. Find you an older set from 2003 or earlier & prepare to be amazed.

Plus, the 16 ohm speakers in the 2x12s are generally more top endy & cutting than the 8 ohm version which are smoother.

I wondered about this too, but all my amps go through one cab, so I'm really only hearing the differences, and the Mark VII and Mark III don't have the same buzzy quality to them as the JP2C Also, the 240hz slider on the JP does something totally different than the other 2, must be a different Q value (bandwidth)

 

[playingitloud]

I too am interested in this as I've found my new JP2C to be quite buzzy compared to my Mark VII, wondering if the older model had less "fizz"; really wish my JP2C sounded like my Mark VII (in Mark IIC+ and IV modes), that thing is just the perfect balance of nice top-end and punchy lows

I found swapping at least one preamp tube had cleaned up the buzzy/fizzy sound on my JP-2C.

We did the same on my friend’s JP-2C and it helped it as well.

 

[ultra high gain]

I seem to notice a stark difference now between ch 2 presence pulled (10-11 o'clock), and ch3 presence pushed (noonish). Maybe you might prefer presence pushed, it's way bassier: I have to lower EQ2 (I use it with ch3) more than EQ1 80hz. It might kill what you perceive as "buzz".

 

[soloistthree]

I seem to notice a stark difference now between ch 2 presence pulled (10-11 o'clock), and ch3 presence pushed (noonish). Maybe you might prefer presence pushed, it's way bassier: I have to lower EQ2 (I use it with ch3) more than EQ1 80hz. It might kill what you perceive as "buzz".

I was playing my JP2C just now, had the 6.6k slider down to like 1-2, started to hear an intermittent fluctuation of a really high presence tone, the buzz basically, it was as though someone had a momentary switch connected to the presence knob that would toggle it off and on, at random. So there is definitely something wrong with my new JP2C. Maybe a preamp tube, maybe a cold solder joint. I just now put in a request to Mesa for warranty service. We'll see how this goes

 

[mark0]

yep. ur gonna need all the same tubes to compare both to hear the difference. had em both wide by side. loud, diff tubes. barely could tell. schumacher “gives” a lil more.
i prefer the early one feel.

 

[ultra high gain]

I was playing my JP2C just now, had the 6.6k slider down to like 1-2, started to hear an intermittent fluctuation of a really high presence tone, the buzz basically, it was as though someone had a momentary switch connected to the presence knob that would toggle it off and on, at random. So there is definitely something wrong with my new JP2C. Maybe a preamp tube, maybe a cold solder joint. I just now put in a request to Mesa for warranty service. We'll see how this goes

Damn, are you able to swap preamp tubes before you spend the shipping $ + service? I hope it's just that. But if it's under warranty, do they pay for shipping? Might as well, huh? Or a local authorized tech?

 

[soloistthree]

****, are you able to swap preamp tubes before you spend the shipping $ + service? I hope it's just that. But if it's under warranty, do they pay for shipping? Might as well, huh? Or a local authorized tech?

Yeah, this is my first time ever needing to repair an amp, it's only 3 months old, they responded to me earlier today, asked for date of purchase. Hoping I hear back from them tomorrow.

It's a shame, I used to have a buinch of preamp tubes laying around. Not anymore, sadly. Also, they are what $30/per these days? So $150 to replace them all

 

[Darkstar2]

I found swapping at least one preamp tube had cleaned up the buzzy/fizzy sound on my JP-2C.

We did the same on my friend’s JP-2C and it helped it as well.

Any chance you recall which tube made the difference? Which V1 through V5? I swapped ANOS RCA and GE for V1 through V4 and I put a Sovtek 12ax7 LPS in V5 (phase inverter).

 

[bandit2013]

Yeah, this is my first time ever needing to repair an amp, it's only 3 months old, they responded to me earlier today, asked for date of purchase. Hoping I hear back from them tomorrow.

It's a shame, I used to have a buinch of preamp tubes laying around. Not anymore, sadly. Also, they are what $30/per these days? So $150 to replace them all

I had ordered some Mesa 12AX7, took much longer to get than expected. At the time, SW was sold out as was every other distributor. I can find them now though. $26 for the standard, $30 for the SPAX7. Considering the current cost of the JP2C, I would personally ship it to Petaluma for repair. Hope you get it resolved.

 

[soloistthree]

I had ordered some Mesa 12AX7, took much longer to get than expected. At the time, SW was sold out as was every other distributor. I can find them now though. $26 for the standard, $30 for the SPAX7. Considering the current cost of the JP2C, I would personally ship it to Petaluma for repair. Hope you get it resolved.

Yep, done, sent this afternoon!

 

[ultra high gain]

Will you have to pay for shipping if it's a Mesa fault under warranty? I've never shipped to them, and have done only local (15 -30 miles) repairs in the past. It's a good thing it's going to Mesa's hands, I would feel safe.