Amp Love!!!

[thinskin57]

i'm going to preface what i'm about to say, by saying that i was once "one" of these people i'm about to talk about.

we've all been guilty of lusting for, and buying the best guitar we can afford. unfortunately, usually at the expense of the quality level of amplifier we can afford after spending two grand or more on a guitar. now that i'm a bit older and more experienced, i realized a few years back that it should be the opposite- buy the best possible amp you can afford, then worry about the guitar. it pains me to see people make the same mistake i did- playing a $3,000 guitar through a $500 solid-state amp. i won't mention brand names. like i really need to?

a $500 korean knockoff (especically today's!) will sound better through a great amp than a great guitar will sound through a cheapo, crappy budget amp. and yes, i know- there are some great budget tube amps now available for cheap, but they're really not quite the same as say, a nice big Tremoverb. (not that bigger means better. just one example)

so there. i just had to say it. if there are any noobs reading this, don't take this lightly. i know guitars are "cooler" than those "appliances" that sit in the dark behind you on stage, but you'll likely sound and play a lot better!

can i get an Amen?

 

[ixoye777]

Couldn't agree more. I made the same mistake when I started playing. I spend 90% of my budget on the guitar (LP Custom) and 10% on the amp (15w Marshall Solid State). It sounded like garbage. I ended up selling my LP and buying an acoustic. Getting rid of that axe is one of my biggest regrets.

I ended up quiting guitar after playing for a mere 6 months - I sounded like crap and it wasn't fun. If I had known then to buy a good amp first I likely would have been playing for the last 15 years. As it stands I started up again about a year ago and now that I have a good amp I enjoy practicing and playing.

Good post thinskin57, I wish I had read something like this back in the day.

 

[Heritage Softail]

Great point and one not easily taken to heart. I have recenly started back taking lessons again. As well as equipment becomes important, keeping your mind in a learning mode for music can be gratifying as well. Some like to take up other instruments, my other instrument is a Harley Davidson 8) Them pipes make sweet music! :lol: :lol:

Hope you enjoy your Boogie. Lots of Tone Love in there.

 

[Turumbar82]

I completely agree with you. I think it's much better to have a decent guitar and a great amp than a great guitar and a cheap amp.

 

[212Mavguy]

Hey Thinskin....

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMEEEEEEEEEENNN! 8)

Peace.

 

[94Tremoverb]

I'm not sure...

I agree that a cheap guitar through a great amp will probably sound better than a great guitar through a cheap amp - although it depends what you mean by a cheap amp, for example a Fender Silverface Champ is a small, cheap amp but has wonderful tone.

But I would rather have a good guitar through a good amp (which don't have to be expensive) than a bad guitar through a great amp. A good guitar just inherently sounds better and will let you get more out of your playing, and you will learn more when both respond properly together. You might initially get a better sound from a cheap guitar through a great amp, but what you learn from playing them will be how to fight a cheap guitar - which is not a bad skill to have, but I find learning how to fight a cheap amp is more useful, because you're more likely to have to play your own guitar through a provided amp than the other way round.

 

[Don]

I have more good amps than good guitars!

 

[thinskin57]

I have more good amps than good guitars!

that's the way you do it!

 

[Anonymous]

I agree to an extent. My first great guitar is the Les Paul Standard I have now, and since I've gotten it, my playing has improved at a much higher rate than it did when I was on my previous Jackson DK2T. Now granted, I got the nice amps first, before my Les Paul, but even still, I think so much good comes out of a great guitar than a good or bad guitar that it might just be worth having.

However, I think it's possible to get both. The thing is, there are - like 94Tremoverb was saying - many cheap amps out there that sound great. Point in case, I just picked up a Peavey VTM120 for $300. I'm sure if I wanted I could also find a decent 2x12 with V30s or something for about $200, making the total cost about $500. Sure, these deals are difficult to come by and won't give you Rectifier tone, but if I were just starting out again, I'd get a decent used tube amp and then get the nicest guitar I could.

Just my 2 cents! And who knows? I'm one of the people that got the expensive amp first, so maybe the grass is just always greener on the other side!

 

[derekjason]

can i get an Amen?

amen preach on brotha.

 

[Turumbar82]

I still play mediocre guitars into a better amp. I do hope to remedy that soon though. I think it's time to upgrade to a professional quality guitar very soon though.

 

[jpdennis]

..., my other instrument is a Harley Davidson 8) Them pipes make sweet music! :lol: :lol:

A kindred spirit. Hmmmm, why everyone says I play too loud? It's the tone we go for, it just needs some girth to get there :lol: Of course my bikes are a little modified, just like my axes and amps 8)

So this is an interesting thread. I started playing awhile back and was raised on an old Harmony acoustic that made my finger nails peel back from the tips enough to bleed. I had no clue about tone as I was just ripping my fingers so I could steel up and "bend dem strings". Once I went electric most my gear cost about $200.00 when that equaled $500.00 to $700.00 by todays amount. I bought this Silvertone amp (the SS piggyback from Sears catalog in 1967) and a used Guild Starfire single PU. I listened to many records by different pop to early rock players and set my sights on a 335. I knew it sounded just great. Only thing was I could not get the sounds I heard when it did arrive. Then a friend let me play it though his 1971 double stack Marshall 100W. Man it did sound great even if I didn't. As I was able to get a Mesa clone [yea I know it is embarrassing to admit - even Mike B was amazed I had not one but two of the famous cease and desist amps until the past year] from a pawn shop which was also how I got the 1969 GoldTop (or as Gibson told me later the 1970 early prototype assembled in 1969 1/2). Anyway I was lucky to have stage workers produce my sound since I could come close to a great tone but always fall short of what it could have been. Then came the real deal and it is like night and day. I just picked up a Baker made by Ed Roman which is an inexpensive guitar that plays extremely well and sounds amazing though any of my amps, but especially the Heartbreaker. 8)

Had I known then what I know now I would have saved for the amp and bought the best playing guitar I could find on the cheap. Once I started playing professionly I would have then bought a great guitar. Instead I wasted a lot of money on things I do not have to show for it today. Thank God I made it back and am now doing rather well with a well rounded life.

My 2 cents

Dennis

 

[Heritage Softail]

..., my other instrument is a Harley Davidson 8) Them pipes make sweet music! :lol: :lol:

A kindred spirit. Hmmmm, why everyone says I play too loud? It's the tone we go for, it just needs some girth to get there :lol: Of course my bikes are a little modified, just like my axes and amps 8)

So this is an interesting thread. I started playing awhile back and was raised on an old Harmony acoustic that made my finger nails peel back from the tips enough to bleed. I had no clue about tone as I was just ripping my fingers so I could steel up and "bend dem strings". Once I went electric most my gear cost about $200.00 when that equaled $500.00 to $700.00 by todays amount. I bought this Silvertone amp (the SS piggyback from Sears catalog in 1967) and a used Guild Starfire single PU.

My 2 cents

Dennis

Dennis,

That is too funny man, I was 14 and had a Sears Silvertone and the black Les Paul copy from the 1975 Sears catalogue, my buddy had a Harmony acoustic with the special 'dogs hind leg' neck. We saved our money for effects pedals since it was so easy to shoplift wine. :shock: :lol:

Good thing about riding a Harley is that they are so expensive my wife doesn't even blink at dropping 2K for the MKV head. :shock: That bike of yours looks like you have some custom paint, chrome, pipes maybe? Nicely done.

 

[jpdennis]

That bike of yours looks like you have some custom paint, chrome, pipes maybe? Nicely done.

Sorry to all for hijacking the thread.

HS,

Actually, that is a picture of one of my favorite's - the WLA - which I can only wish I owned . I own a FLHR, XL1200R, an old Virago, and an older '65 Norton Commando I am putting together this year after collecting all the pieces and getting the frame parts powder coated. I will PM you in the future about bikes.

Now for the thread,

Yea, the Silvertone was quite the amp for that Surf clean "don't bend the strings" while trying some slight blues licks. But plug in the Maestro Fuzztone (remember?) and fuzz that thing. Do you remember Zal's (Loving Spoonful) reference to his "throw-up" guitar in one of the Spoon's songs (I think Jug Band Music)?

Dennis

 

[emperor_black]

Amen!.

However, I would like to add that, a badass amp through a crappy cab makes the entire effort futile. So, I'd say, start backwards, get a decent cab, a great amp, a decent guitar and you should be set.

However, I also agree that at early stages of learning, a great guitar can help you learn faster than having to deal with build quality of cheaper guitars. My first big guitar purchase when I was still a noob was a Fender highway 1. Even though I think its a crappy guitar compared to my USA jackson, it still helped me learn a LOT of techniques much faster than a $99 Dean.

Now that I have the Uber and a Mark IV, I can get seriously great tones with my $300 DK2T and DK2M that I've been having thoughts about selling my SL2HT.

 

[thinskin57]

So, I'd say, start backwards, get a decent cab, a great amp, a decent guitar and you should be set.

original poster here. good point. being a combo guy, you can see how i might have forgotten that point.

while i'm here, due to a couple of well meaning nit-picker responses, i'd like to clarify that i was generalizing a bit with the original post as i was trying to keep it under 10,000 words! to be a little more specific, i was talking about the guys dropping 2 to 3 grand on a guitar, only to go home and put it through their Line 6 Spider (or the like). and while i'll admit those amps, for the price, are way better than what i had when i started back in 1982, they still hurt ears and even mess w/my chakras!

 

[fishyfishfish]

Couldn't agree more. Dave Hunter said that a cheep guitar can sound pretty cool through a great amp. I would rather have an old Silvertone and my Bogner than a PRS and a MG. David Lindly had a ton of old Airlines and Dano's but played them through Dumbles, the tone was unreal.

 

[Friedmett]

Interesting thread!

When I started back in1993 quite naturally being 18-19 and in school money were mostly on low budget.

Then you quickly learn about monthly payments and so on.

I've heard the sounds of my favorite artist a zillion times allready so when trying out stuff in the only musicstore in town I had some idea. Amp wise there was Marshall or Fender. Being in to rock and metal this was a nobrainer. I nearly always played the 100 watt tube heads at low store kind of volume and my first head was the Marshall 8100. Half solidstate and tube at lest in the preamp.

On purpose when it came to a cab I went with a stock 1960 Marshall JCM 300watt wtih 75 Celestions. I allready prefered for the upgrade to a bigger head which became the Marshall 4100 Dual reverb 100 watt.

For some reasons I never went with small amps. At the store I always played through big ones anyway so that was allready setup in my mind as being the way to go.

The Marshall 4100 got to be Dean Markely I-20 signature 100 watts tube head for rackmount.

Then being a fan of Mr. Blackmore I got a very nice '71 Marshall Major imported from US. It was fun but a bit expensive tubewise and no it does not have that Blackmore drive.

Being on holiday in UK 2000 introduced me to a Marshall 2104 50 watt combo second hand. It only took a few minutes and I had to have it.

It sounded way different than any new Marshall I have ever tried out.


The amp setup is now the Marshall combo and then the Dean Markely I-20 + Mesa Quad preamp and the Marshall 1922 I got when I sold the Major head.

This provides the heavy tones and the classic rock in a small format at apartment volume! which kind of ended the GAS as nothing else around seems to be better.


I always had decent amps right from the start and I did not change to much as it was not that important to do.

When ever I did came across something better in with the new and exchange/sale of the old.

With guitars I had my fair share but again they were of somewhat quality too along the line.

Whenever I traded a guitar I went a step up owerall. By 1994 I had a ESP KH2 and a Gibson Explorer in black/white so it was okay.

It was never about money for GAS that much it was finding the tones and guitar that would be perfect enough to me on a day to day basis.

When I got my Customshop Jackson RR in 1997 I got one of the guitars of my dreams. It turned out to be the one and it still with me. It cost what it did but I'm sticking with it so its worth it.

I traded the Gibson Explorer for a homebuild Strat and that has turned out to be great too as I still got it and love it too.

I did have a Gibson Les Paul historic '57 custom which was awesome but I could not fall in love with it so it had to go.

It is not about money. Its what works for you!

 

[fishyfishfish]

That's the secret: Being able to work with what ya got. I've seen many dudes with huge racks of gear that sounded nothing better than a regular amp with a couple of pedals. I've done the same. Bought tons and tons of gear just to go back to Guitar/Amp set up. And by the way, those old Dean Markly amps kicked butt!

 

[jpdennis]

... And by the way, those old Dean Markly amps kicked butt!

I just dusted off an old Dean Markley K-30RX for rehearsal since I did not have or need to bring the big guns to the hall. I even used my $40.00 off eBay Epiphone Les Paul Junior I modified slightly. I must say the little DM amp kicked even for 17 watts or so. Guess I'll have to update my amp area sig. 8)

Dennis