2-channel Dual Rectos questions!

[no.mop]

Hey, I'm thinking that I'll be grabbing a 2-channel Dual Recto and I have two potential buys.

I'm sure they're both revision G; one of the serial numbers is in the 8000's and the other is in the 11 000's.

In the 2-channel Dual Recto history (http://www.theboogiearchives.com/2ch_dual_recto.html), I read that C and D have a different sound from the G and are tighter, etc. How different are they? How noticeable are the differences?

And also, at what point did Mesa start putting the 3-channel transformers in the 2-channel Dual Rectos? How much of a difference did the transformers make in the sound? Would either of the two I listed have a 3-channel transformer?

Thanks!
Sam

 

[stephen sawall]

I do not know the rest. But I do know the transformer makes up more of the sound of a amp than any other part. It is the core of the sound. If it does not sound good there is nothing you can do to make the amp sound better.

Myself I have a DR Tremoverb I bought on the first run in 94'.

..... and welcome to the forum if I did not say it before.

 

[YellowJacket]

This is a VERY interesting topic. I'm pretty sure I have a Revision F amp but I can't exactly check since it is in storage right now. It has all the telltale signs, smooth covering, small logo, 16 - 8 16 - 8 4 4 speaker jacks, attached power cable, series effects loop, and it came with the coke bottle rectifier and power tubes. I remember how strange those tubes looked, shame I sold them. I think the tubes were a large part of the unique voice of that amp. I'm pretty sure the serial number is 1,000 something. I asked the guy who has it and we'll see what he said. It is a 2 channel blackface and it has a pretty **** nice clean on it! You will all have to wait a least a month for confirmation on this but I'll let you know when I am reunited with my gear!

 

[Elpelotero]

The difference is noticeable, but you can approximate the tightness with a good OD pedal. The 3ch transformers didn't appear until the very end, circa 15-16,000. Only Rev C-F have the original transformers.

 

[YellowJacket]

I checked your amp. The serial number is: R-0026XX and according to the web page you linked, it is a Series F revision.

**interesting**

 

[mikey383]

Yes, it's rumored that C and D sound tighter, a tad brighter, etc. But most of the differences can be dialed out.

Here is an interesting fact that I'm sure most people who compare these amps aren't aware of: The exact same settings on different amps will yeild different results, regardless of what revision it is, or even if the exact same components are used. This is because the pots have a 20% tolerance. A 1K pot could be anywhere from 800-1200 ohms and still be good. That can account for quite a bit of difference in sound.

About the trannies: Mesa went to the 3 channel versions in 2000, around 16-17000. I don't know how much different these trannies sound, but my friend has one of the last 2 channel Triples which doesn't sound much different than my 6000 SN Dual.

A Recto is going to sound like a Recto, regardless of what revision/year it is. All it comes down to is if you want to spend the extra dough on a "trophy" amp.

 

[fluff191]

Either one of the 2 Channel Rectos will be great amps. So you can't go wrong.

 

[Elpelotero]

I checked your amp. The serial number is: R-0026xx and according to the web page you linked, it is a Series F revision.

**interesting**

As the author of the web page, I should note that it may be a Revision G. Just because I've never seen a Rev G with a serial number in the 2600's doesn't mean it may not exist.

 

[no.mop]

Alright, thanks everyone!

Of course, if anyone else has something to add, I'd love to hear it

 

[YellowJacket]

I checked your amp. The serial number is: R-002602 and according to the web page you linked, it is a Series F revision.

**interesting**

As the author of the web page, I should note that it may be a Revision G. Just because I've never seen a Rev G with a serial number in the 2600's doesn't mean it may not exist.

Maybe? If so it will be the first Blackface Revision G with a series effects loop, 16 - 8/ 16 - 8/ 4/ 4/ speaker jack configuration, small name plate, smooth covering, and attached power cable (according to your website). Listen, I'll open it and let you know what it says inside when I'm moved back out west for school. I just found it interesting that my amp had such a great clean and those weird coke bottle tubes when I got it. I sold the tubes and the original blue power light cover and I kind of regret that now. My brother always commented on how the tone I got out of my Dual wasn't so 'generic' like all the recordings we heard on the radio. Interesting . . .

Hey, I am curious about something: Have you checked how running different tubes affects the tone of the Dual Rectifiers because in my experience, it can alter the sound a lot. The original STR 420 have a really sweet musical sound just how you describe the original boogies. The 'trouble' with audio equipment is that every component colours the sound in some way. How much of the 'original dual' tone is a result of the stock tubes it was equipped with!??

I'm also curious about speakers Mesa uses in the Standard Rectocabs. The site says they are 240watt cabs but mine is badged as a 280 watt cab. I've been told that v30s are 60watt speakers and 70watt speakers. I also know that Celestion does custom jobs for amp builders. The serial number on my cab is c1**** so it really isn't that old. I think it is a custom job as far as I was told when I bought it. (I got it barely used from some guy who never played it and I had to break in the speakers myself. He nearly shat himself when he heard it with my head.)

*edit* I just read on the site about the double blind test with the tubes. I guess it is good to read first and ask questions later.

 

[stephen sawall]

The early Vintage 30's were 60 before the 70 watt ones came out.

 

[Silverwulf]

Maybe? If so it will be the first Blackface Revision G with a series effects loop, 16 - 8/ 16 - 8/ 4/ 4/ speaker jack configuration, small name plate, smooth covering, and attached power cable (according to your website).

The website is wrong (on that matter). My '94 is exactly as described above (seen below), built into a "Pre-500" chassis. There's a special run that were done in that manner, probably using up leftover chassis. This includes Dual, Triple, and even some Rackmounts. I speculate less than 50 were done like this during that run, though it's possible that there were some done a little earlier (though I've never seen any evidence of it).

 

[Metaltastic]

A Recto is going to sound like a Recto, regardless of what revision/year it is. All it comes down to is if you want to spend the extra dough on a "trophy" amp.

SERIOUSLY - a dude on the Sneap forum has a Revision F Dual Rec, and the clips he's re-amped through his Recto cab don't sound noticeably different than my the same DI's re-amped through my Revision G/Recto cab (and what differences there are are probably more due to tube choice, differences in speakers, his cab being a straight, different room, and him being in Germany and thus running at 240 volts ) A 2 ch. is a 2 ch., screw paying even an extra $1k for a lower serial # IMO! (although if you get a good deal on one, then of course there's no reason not to)

 

[Metaltastic]

As the author of the web page, I should note that it may be a Revision G. Just because I've never seen a Rev G with a serial number in the 2600's doesn't mean it may not exist.

Hey dude, I wanted to congratulate you on (and thank you for) making such a well-written and informative page; it's a great read! Also, on the topic of ebay hype and stuff, Check out this listing for a 2 ch. Dual Rectifier I stumbled upon on ebay (bold facing added):

If you're looking at this amp then you know what you're looking at. This is one of the first Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifiers ever made. This is called the Black Faced Chrome Chasis. This is the monster beast of all monsters. There is not an amp on the planet that can touch one of these amps. This amp a few months back was selling on Ebay for $2500 used...If you know about these amps they are pure untamed power and gain from the depts of hell. These amps increase in volume once the tubes heat up and warm to full growth [ :roll: ] Unlike the Marshall that when heated up continue to drop volume and gain this amp just roars louder and louder...You will not find anything like this on the earth. Once you've tried this there will never be another amp change for your musical career.

Except it ISN'T one of the first models ever made, far from it as a matter of fact. So my message to him:

Hi, just wanted to let you know that because it has the large Mesa logo and parallel FX loop, this is actually a Revision G Dual Rectifier, meaning it has a serial number of around 2800 or higher, and is identical to every 2 ch. made subsequently (except for the attached power cord, which was shortly dropped). Of course, I doubt you'll change your item description since hype = profit, but it is definitely NOT one of the first Dual Recs ever made

SOURCE: http://www.theboogiearchives.com/2ch_dual_recto.html

His response:

The black faced Mesa Boogies are actually the first Dual Rectifiers made.

(real convincing counter-argument there)

My response:

No, the option has been available through the whole run, and more importantly the parallel FX loop is the dead giveaway (and I notice you didn't post the serial # in the auction description). But hey, there's a sucker born every minute, so good luck snagging him!

Just doing my part to sustain INTERNET JUSTICE

 

[mikey383]

What a tool that guy is.

 

[Metaltastic]

Ain't it so! Though at least he has since posted the serial # (R-007160 :lol: ), though the "this is one of the first Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifiers ever made" bit still remains :roll:

 

[mikey383]

I sent him a message:

Just wanted to correct some of your information: This is not one of the first Rectifiers made, it is the 7671st Recto made. It also did not sell for $2500 a few months ago...it's about 7200 serial numbers off. It is not rare either - there are about 15000 of these available.


Yeah, I know. I'm a dick.

 

[Metaltastic]

I sent him a message:

Just wanted to correct some of your information: This is not one of the first Rectifiers made, it is the 7671st Recto made. It also did not sell for $2500 a few months ago...it's about 7200 serial numbers off. It is not rare either - there are about 15000 of these available.


Yeah, I know. I'm a dick.

Haha, well at least it wasn't me this time! You're doing god's work

 

[stephen sawall]

This is interesting. :mrgreen:

 

[mikey383]

Here was his reply:

Well then I guess the one that I have that I play is. The serial number is 230.

I told him that would be one of the desirable pre 500s, but the one he has listed is the common Rev. G.