Volume!?

[Dead Moon Rising]

" if it's too loud you're too old " this phrase pisses me off lately

i run sound at a bar with a 13' square stage and a maximum legal capacity of 50 people. but i constantly have to deal with bands who bring full stacks and play loud enough to clear the bar out. I could fill pages and pages of stories about the locals and nationals i've worked with over the years. Personally i'm tired of arguing with people when they play so loud you can't hear the vocals, customers leave, and everyone complains to me like it's my fault. not to mention the bar loses buisness because the bartender can't hear customers' orders and they leave to go somewhere where they can order a drink. yet the bands still want to be paid after driving away the customers.

it's 90% the rock and metal bands. though i did mix a country cover band that played direct with pods and bitched that they need more monitors, then less, then more, everytime they changed patches (learn to set levels). and the bar was almost empty when they played and afterward their "leader" threw a fit and almost got in a fight with the owner becasue they didn't get paid $450 for playing to a **** near empty bar.

i find it ironic that the bands that praise me the most are the one's who turned down their amps when i said they were too loud. after the show, i'd have memebers thank me for the great stage mix! and that it was the first time they heard everything so clear, when all i did was have them turn down a bit so you could heard the other instuments (remember it's a 13' square stage).

I once even had a band play so loud you couldn't hold a converstion on the paito outside of the bar. then when i told them to turn down theiy said they can't, at which point an argument ensued and a lot of explicatives where thrown (by me, [ I'm so sick of dumbass' ] ) so i said if they want to play that loud they could play with no FOH. so they played a whole set with no PA (or lights). I even told them i will turn the PA (and lights) back on when you turn down becasue you're so loud you couldn't hear the vocals anyway. but would they turn down? nope.


what's so important about being loud? why do bands cry when they can't fit 4 stacks on a 13' square stage, or they cry because i made them turn down, and/or cry when they don't get paid becasue they suck so bad they cleaned the place out.

why is playing thru full stacks (on a 13' stage) so **** important?

i don't even mean famous people, i'm talking about local nobody's with 5 fans who think their god's gift to music. the nationals i've worked with were all great (except a stoner band from england who's guitarist moaned and whined all night long because he turned his marshall from 10 to 8 [ which wouldn't even register on a spl meter] after the cops theatend to shut down the show).

i don't even know where i'm going in posting all this. i just want to know why rock musicans are so freaking stupid. and maybe rant about dumbass musicians.

I boggles my brain...

i haven't even mentioned drummers, bassist, and singers!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ned]

My bass player and I both use modelers and when necessary our drummer uses v-drums. No one has ever complained about our volume. We run our own sound so you can bet the levels are set right since we can't be tweaking the monitor mix between every song.

 

[kiff]

rookies are usually like that. personally, I don't know why you'd want to be really loud; I need to hear the rest of the band. that's as important than hearing youself...

 

[Elpelotero]

I think it's an ego thing and a need to "feel like a rockstar" and show off the "stack." These are usually the same idiots that don't know what the EQ knobs do or how to play a power chord without one finger. I would put a sign saying if you don't turn your volume down, you don't play or get paid or something like that.

 

[Riff Blister]

I never really got that attitude either. It's an ego trip.

When you are hired by a bar owner or manager as entertainment they are the ones writing you the check at the end of the night.
I don't know about other people but I call them "Boss".

As for the people you are being paid to entertain....well if they are leaving you are not doing what you are being paid to do.

If the band I'm in is told to turn it down (and sometimes it happens) we are happy to comply.

We want to get asked back.

 

[Southernhell]

I understand what the OP is saying. The same thing can be turned right back around on him as a sound guy. I have run into way too many sound men that only know how to use their PA utilizing one setting. Do not know how to pull the guitars down out of the mix if the guitars are a little on the loud side, do not know how to mix monitor audio at all so all the musicians get is nothing but headache inducing high end of the mix, etc..

I think it is best for the band to speak with the sound guy before they play and discuss the situation. When I play live, I turn my amp up enough so that I can hear myself just a tad over the drums, but also so that my other guitarist can hear me across the stage as we know that soundmen in small clubs, just cannot give us a monitor mix to save their lives. If thats too loud, then that is their problem. Learn to give us a decent monitor mix so then we CAN turn down a bit.

 

[clutch71]

I'm no sound man, but I've noticed this at the Newport Music Hall and Alrosa Villa here in Columbus. Clutch was so loud one time (I was even in the balcony, not on the main floor) that my ears fatigued so quickly I really only enjoyed the first half of the set. I was thinking, Man, what is that sound man doing?

I also saw Coal Chamber and two local bands who got progressively louder from set to set. My ears were pretty shot by the time Coal Chamber came on.

Each instance I attribute it to the lack of a good sound man. I've seen several great shows at each venue and I'm usually toward the back of the main floor. It's OK to walk out with a little ringing, but if it last for more than two days, I'm sure some damage was done.

Kudo's to you for having the courage to tell the local yocals to turn it down a little.

 

[Red Barchetta]

Here is a bit of a different perspective. My old classic rock cover band was playing this small club out in "Coon D!ck" Louisiana. Stage was about 20 x 15...club was a big rectangle. The first time we played there, the crowd wasn't that big, so the room was only about half full. The soundman had a FANTASTIC f.o.h. mix, our stage volume was nice, the stage sound tight, and we had a terrific time. Literally one of the top 10 soundguys I have ever worked with in 25+ years of gigging.

We were enthusiastically invited back, so we booked several more shows....


The second gig there was to a much fuller house...complete with the strippers who worked there during the day (who knew?)

The soundman was proudly showing off his new f.o.h. rig and monitor setup...we were all stoked, because of the fabulous job he had done with his old system. Brief soundcheck, all's well...go to the dressing rooms to chill....then time to go on.

THE F.O.H. MIX WAS SO FLIPPIN' LOUD THAT I LITERALLY FELT PAIN. Jeeeezzuuuus! The mix was so loud, the reflection off the audience and back wall of the club was DEAFENING! My God! We begged the soundman to lower things...we...US...THE FRIGGIN' BAND thought it was too loud....he wouldn't turn down...said it sounded fine to him...
In self defense, we all turned our rigs down as low as we could and still get sound out of 'em, but it did no good. I swear that soundman just cranked f.o.h. until we were getting feedback from the guitars on less than "1". Unbelievable. We muddled thru the set the best we could and cornered him outside to try and get him to turn down. Of course to corner him, we had to pull him from his "smoking den" in his pickup truck in the parking lot...he was pretty baked, and I'm guessing that had something to do with his auditory issues...(I dunno...that never happened to anyone I know)

Anyway, long story short...the club emptied out, the club owner was too drunk (and I suspect to deaf) to care, the soundman continued to try and kill us with sound waves, and we canceled the 4 upcoming shows, including a lucrative New Year's Eve gig. The only bright spot was that the strippers were EXTREMELY hot, and posed for all kinds ( :twisted: ) of pics with the band!

I have never had the shoe on the other foot quite like that before. I have never experienced a soundman so LOUD. Even playing outdoor fests like the Heritage Fest, I've never known a f.o.h. mix to sound so loud.

I guess it takes all types.

RB