Mark IV "breathy" tone?

[SeasonOfPain]

Hi all,

Is it just me, or does my Mark IV sound "breathy"? It's kind of hard to describe, but my tone doesn't seem as "fat" as it should. It's much more noticable on recordings, but I'm not sure if I can put it down to mic placement and/or other gear. Is it the tubes (they're factory Mesas)? Maybe even the guitar (it could use a good setup)?

I finally put some recordings up on Soundclick; if any of you can take a listen and provide some feedback on the tone, I'd appreciate it.

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=359240

The Mark IV is featured on all guitars on Elementia, and the lead guitar in Alone (the effect is much more pronounced on the leads). The Mark was run through a Mesa Standard 4x12, miced using SM-57 running into MBox/PT rig. Guitar is an Ernie Ball JPMM signature.

Any suggestions?

 

[wolfgang6505]

I personally think your tone sounds great. try a graphic eq 10-15 band in your loop if you would like to alter the the sound. I think you could beef up the lows a bit. This is just an idea. i think it sounds great the way it is though soo... What type of mic are you using ? Are you not even using a mic?

 

[wolfgang6505]

I'm sorry, you listed your mic, how did I miss this? i don't know but I did so disregard my statement concerning your mic. This Wolf hasn't had enough piggies today I guess LOL sorry.

 

[SeasonOfPain]

Thanks for the feedback!

The recording was pretty basic, done using a Shure SM-57 to close-mic a Recto Standard 4x12 (in a carpeted, furnished basement). This was run via an MBox to ProTools.

I did apply EQ to the guitars when mixing the track, but I can't recall the settings. Perhaps there's a fundamental frequency I'm dropping out. Strange that I'd get the same effect on both songs, though.

It's not the recording rig itself, as the other song "Family Portrait" was done with my Triaxis before I sold it, and the guitar tone there doesn't have the "breathy"/"airy" effect. Maybe it's just a subjective thing.

I can definitely tell the difference between my tone and Nitrobattery's, which was recorded with the same amp & cab. Obviously, a lot of other variables come into play (besides Nitro's superior skill ).

 

[Monsta-Tone]

I'm pretty sure that the Mark IV's tone is designed to cut through the mix.

I've noticed with mine that it has a much more narrow, focussed tone. My Rectoverb sounded much fatter, but the Reverb sucked. I sold the Rectoverb, but I'm kind of regretting it now since my Mark IV isn't working with my new band.


You could try boosting the bass a little bit with the onboard EQ. I boost the mids a little bit. In my opinion, it sounds way fatter than the standard "V" shape for the EQ.

 

[scottywompas]

I think it sounds pretty good. I guess you just have to fiddle around with it a little. I've found when I am recording that I end up turning the knobs on an amp to places they would not normally be.

Scott

 

[diamondschwin]

i definetly see where you are going with the breathy thing, i heard it instantly when the guitar kicked in.

a couple of things i would try, less gain, more treble, to get more upper midrange crunch, this could help you because mayeb there is too much sizzle and its fooling your ear into thinking its lacking bottom (this would also add more harmonics into the mix, backing up the fundamental)

when recording with bass make sure you dont cut the harmonics up into the mid range (around 500hz etc.) because those will reinforce your tone, and in the mix it wont sound as boxy or flabby as it does soloed (the bass that is, but your tone will get a nice boost)

different mic placement could also help, off axis with the 57, backing it off the grill, to 6 inches, a foot etc. or possibly using another mic (id suggest a condenser set to cardioid or hyper cardioid) as a distant mic, maybe at about waist height (since you are using a half stack) around 3 feet back, of course you are going to run into phase issues so this is just a general guideline so youll have to work on the mic placement a little more exact for what works for your room etc.

i hope any of that helps, i am leaning towards a recording issue since you say its noticeable in recordings, but maybe you are suffering from the Fletcher Munson curve effect and your recording levels are lowere then your practice levels?

i dont know, keep us updated, i hope it works out for ya!

 

[SeasonOfPain]

Thanks for the detailed feedback, diamondschwin! At the moment, other than a semi-crappy V-Twin dynamic mic, I'm only in possession of an SM-57. I was considering getting a 2nd condenser mic to record vocals with (and hopefully also be able to use as a distant mic). Any recommendations for a halfway-decent model priced $3-500?

That said, I know a decent tone can be captured with "just" a 57, so I'm determined to resolve that if I can before adding a ton of additional variables with a second mic.

I've moved to a new house since making that recording, and now have a ton of new variables to deal with in my recording environment (unfinished basement, lots of hard, reflective surfaces, no carpet). Thus I'm now finding it a lot harder to get even as good a tone as I had (the low end is noticeably missing on 7/8 of the mic placements I tried). It's incredibly tedious; I'm doing this solo, recording in the same room that the cabinet is in. so I have to adjust the mic, don headphones, record a part, then play it back to see how good it sounds, make a 1/4" adjustment on the mic position, then try again.

Regarding the bass recording: I'm using an OLP Stingray copy (run direct via a POD). Any EQ or patch recommendations to complement a MarkIV tone?

As far as volume goes, if anything I'm playing much louder than normal practice levels (I have tweaked the amp to sound good at that volume).

I'm playing around with recording a cover tune; I'll see what I can put together and post a link when I have a rough take.