I'm new to the whole tube amp world and I have my own Dual Rec...I've had it being bought brand new for about 3 months now and wonder how long the tubes are estimated? I've heard 6 months, a year, two years...until they need to be replaced agian. :?:
Life of 6L6's
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thunda1216
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I got 5 years out of a set of Sovtek 6L6WXT+ tubes in a Peavey Deuce (and that's 40+ hours/ week). So far, 6 years on a set of Winged C 6L6 tubes in a Heartbreaker, about the same amount of usage (including inadvertantly leaving the amp on over night more than once). I have gotten similar mileage from Shuguang 6L6 tubes in both Mesa and Pignose amps, and these don't have a standby, so you throw it to the tubes every time you fire them up!
The tube sellers will want you to change more often, as they are in the business of selling tubes. Don't fall for it. Keep a couple of spares, and change them when you start hearing strange noises, they start glowing really red, or they stop working.
FYI: I've got a 60+ year old Blaupunkt tube console that still works! You can't even get replacement tubes for it. It will continue to get intermittant usage until it dies.
The point is: don't obsess about the tubes, the gadgets, the bias, the alignment of the planets. Obsess about the playing. I have a fellow motorcyclist who is always washing his bike. He asked me why I didn't wash my hog so often. My reply was that total time minus wash time equals riding time. The same applies to your amp. Play it!
ty
The tube sellers will want you to change more often, as they are in the business of selling tubes. Don't fall for it. Keep a couple of spares, and change them when you start hearing strange noises, they start glowing really red, or they stop working.
FYI: I've got a 60+ year old Blaupunkt tube console that still works! You can't even get replacement tubes for it. It will continue to get intermittant usage until it dies.
The point is: don't obsess about the tubes, the gadgets, the bias, the alignment of the planets. Obsess about the playing. I have a fellow motorcyclist who is always washing his bike. He asked me why I didn't wash my hog so often. My reply was that total time minus wash time equals riding time. The same applies to your amp. Play it!
ty
I also was wondering, is it better to say, start up the amp. play for say, a few hours, then turn it off and then turn it back on again maybe an hour later to play some more or would it be better for the tube's lifespan to just keep the amp on standby all day and have the tubes be on constantly for, say, an 8 hour period?
Use the standby religiously and your power tubes will last way longer.
But, if your not using the amp for 15 minutes or longer (standard bar band break), shut it down. Always let it warm up on standby for the 30-60 seconds recommended before playing.
But, if your not using the amp for 15 minutes or longer (standard bar band break), shut it down. Always let it warm up on standby for the 30-60 seconds recommended before playing.
212Mavguy
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Interesting questions here! For intermittent use throughout the day I'd prefer to go ahead and shut off the amp between sessions. For gig use, I am a very firm believer to turn it on and NOT use standby for band breaks...here are a few reasons why...
1) Ever notice how a tube amp takes a while to really get it's tone and volume after startup? Gets both louder and smoother sounding. I have found that a cold biased power section takes longer to get to it's sweet spot than a hotter bias class A setup, like maybe 10-15 minutes class A, up to to a half hour or so for a cold biased class AB power section amp...the more powerful power tubes like 6l6's take longer than say, el84's as well. I like my volume and tones to stay stable for all night, particularly when using a master volume design. I have a buddy who has a fairly new Fender Hot Rod Deluxe with 6l6's, approximately 50 watts and that amp is too powerful for the small rooms he plays, it gets too loud for the mix a half hour after startup, very sensitive master volume pot as well, a tiny bit of turn yields a big volume difference, he catches a lot of grief from his bandmates for being too loud.
2) Most mesa amps are biased cold, that is one reason for the long power tube life previous posters wrote about. Most new production tubes are not all that expensive anyway.
3) When you use standby for a band break, that repetitive heating/cooling causes expansion and contraction of the parts inside those tube bottles, and that is not good for the tube life, especially from the microphonics standpoint.
I like to use a low power amp with a low number of tubes in it for personal practice, less tubes are wearing out. Peace.
1) Ever notice how a tube amp takes a while to really get it's tone and volume after startup? Gets both louder and smoother sounding. I have found that a cold biased power section takes longer to get to it's sweet spot than a hotter bias class A setup, like maybe 10-15 minutes class A, up to to a half hour or so for a cold biased class AB power section amp...the more powerful power tubes like 6l6's take longer than say, el84's as well. I like my volume and tones to stay stable for all night, particularly when using a master volume design. I have a buddy who has a fairly new Fender Hot Rod Deluxe with 6l6's, approximately 50 watts and that amp is too powerful for the small rooms he plays, it gets too loud for the mix a half hour after startup, very sensitive master volume pot as well, a tiny bit of turn yields a big volume difference, he catches a lot of grief from his bandmates for being too loud.
2) Most mesa amps are biased cold, that is one reason for the long power tube life previous posters wrote about. Most new production tubes are not all that expensive anyway.
3) When you use standby for a band break, that repetitive heating/cooling causes expansion and contraction of the parts inside those tube bottles, and that is not good for the tube life, especially from the microphonics standpoint.
I like to use a low power amp with a low number of tubes in it for personal practice, less tubes are wearing out. Peace.
Remember, all generalizations are invalid, including the one that says all generalizations are invalid. :lol:
I must admit, from playing many, many gigs with my Mark III, that it does sound better after it warms up. It's less "brittle" or "cold" sounding.
Surprise, surprise, the amp sounds warmer after it gets, er, warm!
I often take it off standby after a minute or so, turn the Master down, and let the amp "run" until it's time to rawk.
Having said that, I wonder if it's the other components, as well as the tubes, warming up, too. The Mark III has the cooling fan, you know, so it may be taking longer to warm up, 'specially in ice-cold air-conditioned rooms.
Using standby is important, but not if it mucks with your sound, man!
As always, YMMV.
I must admit, from playing many, many gigs with my Mark III, that it does sound better after it warms up. It's less "brittle" or "cold" sounding.
Surprise, surprise, the amp sounds warmer after it gets, er, warm!
I often take it off standby after a minute or so, turn the Master down, and let the amp "run" until it's time to rawk.
Having said that, I wonder if it's the other components, as well as the tubes, warming up, too. The Mark III has the cooling fan, you know, so it may be taking longer to warm up, 'specially in ice-cold air-conditioned rooms.
Using standby is important, but not if it mucks with your sound, man!
As always, YMMV.
212Mavguy
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Koreth said:
Another great question! The plates run much hotter when b+ is applied from the standby switch turned to "on." Remember what happens when bias is too hot, the plates get red hot? :wink: Just because they don't get red hot in a correctly biased amp does not mean that they don't heat up several hundred degrees over the temp they get to from heat radiated from the cathode heater by itself. The grids also run hotter when full voltage and current is going through them. All that expanding and contracting stuff is held in place by the mica spacers and grid posts. Repeated heating/cooling expansion/contraction cycles can cause things to get looser.
Ten minutes after turning on the amp with standby switch set to standby you can probably touch the side of a power tube bottle and not burn your hand...try to do that after they have been running for the same amount of time with full power going to the same tube...OOOOWWW! :shock: peace.
thunda1216
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I have a couple of Pignose tube amps without a standby switch. The manufacturer recommends leaving the amp on all the time when playing for an extended period of time. I use the standby switch when I gig with my Heartbreaker. Still, after the second set, the amp heats up and really starts to sing, even using the standby switch. Seems to get louder, too. I experienced the same with an old Peavey Deuce I used to use, and a Marshall Silver Jubilee head a bandmate has.
ty
ty
212Mavguy
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Would be an interesting science project to leavy your HB running through the first set break and see if it starts singing it's sweetest sooner than the third set...no harm in doing that. :wink: New production tubes are relatively inexpensive besides when compared to the cost of that Heartbreaker.
Today I was sitting in with a friends' band in an outdoor music festival and I forgot to turn down the volume knob on one of my pickups in my guitar sitting in a stand ready to go after it had been running 10 minutes before sound check and another half hour past then before coming up, and there was a bit of feedback, so the fearless band leader flipped the standby switch on my Mav, when I got on stage another half hour later and turned standby to run, the amp was fine and just oozed out some tones that the sound guy, bandmates, and audience members were very, very complimentary of. I thought it sounded pretty darn wonderful too. That amp gets to the sweet spot in less than 15 minutes from dead cold, small bottle power tubes run in class A...even though I have several nice boutique amps, there's no way I'm gonna sell that personally tweaked Maverick! I fell in love with that amp all over again today! I still won't use standby between sets though, why should I when the Russian military power tubes I have in it are rated for 5,000 hours?
Today I was sitting in with a friends' band in an outdoor music festival and I forgot to turn down the volume knob on one of my pickups in my guitar sitting in a stand ready to go after it had been running 10 minutes before sound check and another half hour past then before coming up, and there was a bit of feedback, so the fearless band leader flipped the standby switch on my Mav, when I got on stage another half hour later and turned standby to run, the amp was fine and just oozed out some tones that the sound guy, bandmates, and audience members were very, very complimentary of. I thought it sounded pretty darn wonderful too. That amp gets to the sweet spot in less than 15 minutes from dead cold, small bottle power tubes run in class A...even though I have several nice boutique amps, there's no way I'm gonna sell that personally tweaked Maverick! I fell in love with that amp all over again today! I still won't use standby between sets though, why should I when the Russian military power tubes I have in it are rated for 5,000 hours?
fishyfishfish
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I couldn't agree more. Weird noise or smoke, time to change tubes. OR you got plugged into 220v.Scary said:
Old BF Shred
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fishyfishfish said:
A big +2 on that!
The old tele and amperex tubes I have came from old McIntosh tube HiFi gear that was usually left on all day!
A couple did die on me but the rest are going strong after decades of use. They were rated for 10,000+ hours!
And output tubes, if biased properly can also last a very long time! Mesa's do bias on the cold side, and this will help, but good tubes (not defective, that is) can go a long way before complete failure. They do slowly fade with time, so slowly it's hard to notice, (then it becomes a matter of personal preference) but you can get YEARS out of them.
Good luck!
