Current value and collectabilty of the Mark II C+?

[markchatwin]

The amp I'm interested in is the Mark II C head that has been modified to + by MB at MB. It has the verb, 60/100 Watt switchable, EQ. In these troubled times I'm wondering if I should plunge at 2K?

With the Mark V coming out I'm wondering if putting my money in the right place... Will the Mark II C + go up in value or down?

 

[Sixstringpsycho]

My honest opinion is that Vintage equipment holds its value no matter how many amps "voice" or "model" them. If you get a Mark V you are getting a serious amp thats state of the art. if you buy a C+ you are purchasing a vintage amp that has a voice that inspired an entire line of amps.

 

[JimAnsell]

the mark 5 is never going to be a c+.
no matter how much the lead channel sounds like the c+'s lead channel. its still not the same amp.
what about the break up for the c+ clean channel cranked? what about the mid gain crunch on the lead channel with the gain down low but the volume up loud on class a?

get that c->c+ blonde long head that you're probably talking about.
it'll hold its value better than any current production amp will.
it'll probably sound better too.

 

[JOEY B.]

My honest opinion is that Vintage equipment holds its value no matter how many amps "voice" or "model" them. If you get a Mark V you are getting a serious amp thats state of the art. if you buy a C+ you are purchasing a vintage amp that has a voice that inspired an entire line of amps.

I agree completely. Also an item to note is the hellish dynamics of a 60/100 C+ (if it has the "105" power transformer). I hope you like it LOUD :twisted: .

 

[bigmouth]

don't want to spoil anybody's sale, but from a purely financial / investment point of view (what you're asking for) I think you'd be better off with an original as opposed to a "converted to" ? especially if you are talking some years down the road. if you want a converted one there is a B -> C+ on TGP for 1.35 k or an original C for 1.25 k.

 

[markchatwin]

I'm looking for something in particular, what I just lost out on EBAY. I was ready to plunk down $2500 but damned if I got sniped again. It was a IIC 15" head that was converted to a (+). I'm into the head design since I'm pretty much a recording studio guy and prefer to put a cabinet in my ISO booth and play in the control room. Sure from an investment standpoint I'd like a pure (+) amp head but the bottom line is a converted amp is fine since it is the tone I'm looking for. I read in my research that MB at MB feels a converted amp has the same tone as an original. Others, for example one reviewer at "Harmony Central", says the tone is different from a IIC+ original and a IIC that's converted. Bottom line is I will have to wait till another one comes around and get lucky on EBAY. Maybe I should give up the hunt and get a Mark V...

 

[settecorde76]

Well...probably the MarkV is a great versatile amp, but the C+ is the "Holy Grail" with his unique sound...and increase his value day by day, it's a matter of fact.
The question is: do you want a great modern amp or a vintage monster?

 

[markchatwin]

Well then here's a question - if the original is more valueable then the converted what configuration is the "Holy Grail"?

Head or combo?
Reverb no reverb?
Which power transforme?r
Which speaker if it's a combo?

 

[stokes]

I wouldnt put a whole lot into someone saying the modded C to C+ doesnt sound the same as a stock C+.If Mike B.says there is no difference,who you gonna believe?A change of tubes can drastically alter the sound,especially when using the "pre-graded" tubes.I have seen as much as a 15-20ma difference in tubes that were rated the same by Mesa.That will make a big difference in the sound of an amp.Mesa rates the tubes to be "safe" not to draw a certain amount of current,so a tube that draws 20 to 40ma's could be considered "safe".So it wouldnt be unusual for two C+'s to have a totally different sound or feel.

 

[guitarmaster]

:!:

 

[JimAnsell]

I I read in my research that MB at MB feels a converted amp has the same tone as an original. Others, for example one reviewer at "Harmony Central", says the tone is different from a IIC+ original and a IIC that's converted.

ok, who are you going to believe? the guy who invented the mod, and built the amp?
or some jack off on the internet... at harmomy central no less?

please.

a converted c -> c+ is still a c+, and everybit as rare, if not more rare than a factory c+.]
there are actually far fewer c's around than c+'s.
i never understood the stigma of converted c's.
as mike b also said, and as many c+ nerds know, and as with most vintage amps, not all c+'s sound exactly alike anyway.
i guess its just rediculous cork sniffery.

 

[Elpelotero]

Did the writer who argued about the different tone note that the older 2C most likely had a 100 power transformer instead of the C+'s 105? Or export, or whatever? Did he note if one was 60w vs simul? The tubes? etc.

As said, many c+'s do not sound like one another. So it's expected a conversion piece may sound a bit different than a stock.

 

[JOEY B.]

Well then here's a question - if the original is more valueable then the converted what configuration is the "Holy Grail"?

Head or combo?
Reverb no reverb?
Which power transforme?r
Which speaker if it's a combo?

That is a loaded question. What type of guitar tone are you looking for? Metallica or Steely Dan? :wink:

 

[JimAnsell]

those pesky metal heads are f'ing up the value!
:lol:

 

[markchatwin]

Steely Dan for me. I have done exhaustive research on the different Mark II C's, C+'s and though I surely don't know nearly as much as any of the Boogie Pros on this board here is what I think the ultimate one would be.

Long Head
verb
simul
60/100
eq
+
am I missing anything?

Yeh some hardwood and wicker for looks would be cool. But beyond that there really is no way to determine what things are truly worth since every one (II C's and C+'s) have been different. I'd say between $1500 to 4k but that's a big swing. I've only seen 2 true C+'s across the US and a few II C's. Usually there's something I don't like (no reverb, no EQ,)
but finding one that floats your boat is what makes this fun.

 

[JOEY B.]

Steely Dan for me. I have done exhaustive research on the different Mark II C's, C+'s and though I surely don't know nearly as much as any of the Boogie Pros on this board here is what I think the ultimate one would be.

Long Head
verb
simul
60/100
eq
+
am I missing anything?

Yeh some hardwood and wicker for looks would be cool. But beyond that there really is no way to determine what things are truly worth since every one (II C's and C+'s) have been different. I'd say between $1500 to 4k but that's a big swing. I've only seen 2 true C+'s across the US and a few II C's. Usually there's something I don't like (no reverb, no EQ,)
but finding one that floats your boat is what makes this fun.

Well then, if you are looking for more of a smooth tone (not heavy metal) from the C+, I would say that you would do well with a converted B>C+ or C>C+ with the "100" power transformer. Even better might be one with the export X101 power transformer. I would not get too worried about short or long chassis, or even combo or head, as this can be changed at will. Simul 15/75 watt, as well as GEQ and reverb are nice options to have, but not mandatory for a great sounding C+. Just my $.02

 

[bchulse]

I just sent a Mark IIB in to Mike B for updates/upgrades. He told me that the B cannot be upgraded to a C+ due to fundamentally different circuitry. Wish this wasn't the case! I bought my combo a year too early!

 

[markchatwin]

Thanks for all the helpful info. Yeh I read C+ for dummies several times and have researched the Mark II C's quite extensively but yep I need to play one. I have contacted Frank in Ithaca and hopefully he can squeeze me in. I'm in Syracuse, NY if anyone else is nearby. I have heard modern Boogies like the Rectifier and Stilletto Deuce Stage One but not any of the older ones. I'm a 70's guy so yeh Steely Dan and the like are my thing. I'm just going to keep looking on Ebay for a C or + to come up. And the classifieds on this boards as well...

 

[settecorde76]

I love my IIC...I can play rock, blues, jazz, pop and metal with a great simplicity because it can cover many types of sounds...****, it's right that actually there are less IIC than IIC+ because many people decided to convert them in IIC+. The conversion costs around 200$ but it change the overall sound of a IIC; so, in my opinion, buy a IIC+ in head version without simul class. For me this is the best solution you need... :wink:

 

[igfraso]

Joey B., you wrote:

"Well then, if you are looking for more of a smooth tone (not heavy metal) from the C+, I would say that you would do well with a converted B>C+ or C>C+ with the "100" power transformer. Even better might be one with the export X101 power transformer. I would not get too worried about short or long chassis, or even combo or head, as this can be changed at will. Simul 15/75 watt, as well as GEQ and reverb are nice options to have, but not mandatory for a great sounding C+. "

I am curious to understand why a B converted to a C+ has a smoother tone than a factory C+.
I have a B converted with a X101 tranny, 60/100, GEQ and reverb and it sounds fantastic so I don't oppose your above statement.
Yet, what is the reason that a B --> C+ sounds smoother in your opinion?
Thanks and regards