RA-100. Can the brightness be tamed ?

[J.J]

I took my SG (with bare knuckle Mules) to the shop with me today to have give the RA-100 another try out with my main working guitar. I got the shop to set it up with a 2x12 Stiletto cab as that is what I have.

I started on the clean channel with the tone controls all staight up. I was just loving the punch and how my SG sounded with all the pickup combinations. I didn't feel the need to change any settings.

Moving onto the vintage gain. Started with tones all on 12:00 and gain at 2:00. This was way more gain than I am used to with my ED, but dynamics and harmonics and other subtleties were all there. With the gain around 11:00 or so I found what I really wanted a tone that can be fairly clean with light picking that transistions to great crunch when digging in. The only issue was the tone was just to bright and cutting and I could not get a good roaring rhythm tone like the good old JCM800 (I still own a 2203)

I tried lowering the trebble to 9:00, but that seemed to have little effect. Tried the middle at 9:00 and 3:00, but that did not seem help tame things. Raising the bass seemed to help most, but still did not get to what I wanted. The last thing we tried was swapping the 2x12 for a Recto 4x12. The 4x12 was definately more rounded, but not the solution.

How do you RA owners tame things ? Does the brightness become less apparent in a band setting ? Is it just me ?

 

[guitarrhinoceros]

I am not surprised you feel the Royal is bright. Compared to the ED, I'm sure it will absolutely seem that way. The Royal is an amp with a distinct Mesa flavor, in a purely British circuit. When I tooled around on the Royal (which was a considerable two hours worth of jamming) I found it to not be bright at all. The amp has a ton of upper mids in it, but that just is the nature of the circuit.

I'd stick with the ED if I were you, or any other low mid voiced amp.

 

[Assumer]

This is kinda concerning. I always thought the ED sounded great but am taking a chance on the RA. Nobody carries it here so it is being purchased without actually playing it. I am not a fan of super bright amps. I am kinda wondering if I should go back to the ED.

 

[Guitarbuff]

I am not surprised you feel the Royal is bright. Compared to the ED, I'm sure it will absolutely seem that way. The Royal is an amp with a distinct Mesa flavor, in a purely British circuit. When I tooled around on the Royal (which was a considerable two hours worth of jamming) I found it to not be bright at all. The amp has a ton of upper mids in it, but that just is the nature of the circuit.

I'd stick with the ED if I were you, or any other low mid voiced amp.

I believe the ED has a darker tone, but I, too, have not found the RA's channel 2 to be bright. Channel 1 can become thin if you dial back the gain.

 

[lesterpaul]

I have used many a BKnuckle in my day, and mules can be bright-you obviously haven't had that prob with your Marsh,however-I had Mules in a LP and found them to be bright in my Mark amps...they do respond to changes in pickup height...moreso than other pups I have owned(of course, you may not want to do that)
I ended up putting them in another guitar, but after adjusting the height I was able to dial them in quite nicely
I have played the RA with a TAnderson Hollow Tele style guitar,btw, and it was quite nice,indeed...

 

[Assumer]

Just found out mine is coming in this Saturday. I guess I will see firsthand how bright the amp is.

 

[CoG]

Using the attenuator pulls out some brightness. I am pretty sure the amp is voiced with the attenuator in mind. If I do not have it engaged I usually have to dial the treble below noon or back down the tone on my guitar a bit.

I'd also say that LO is very definitely meant to be used in a mix, not while making blues face alone in your basement with a "sweet, full" tone that is actually way too dark for anyone to hear in a band. A lot of tones that sound great in the mix sound bright and feel stiff when you play solo.

 

[lesterpaul]

Just found out mine is coming in this Saturday. I guess I will see firsthand how bright the amp is.

after my experience with a fellow board member's amp, we were suprised there isn't more love for this beast-its next on my list of 'Boogers
-JB has changed some tubes, and don't forget that can really help dial these baies in with your existing equipment...maybe he has some posts on here regarding that(Joey B.)

 

[guitarrhinoceros]

I am not surprised you feel the Royal is bright. Compared to the ED, I'm sure it will absolutely seem that way. The Royal is an amp with a distinct Mesa flavor, in a purely British circuit. When I tooled around on the Royal (which was a considerable two hours worth of jamming) I found it to not be bright at all. The amp has a ton of upper mids in it, but that just is the nature of the circuit.

I'd stick with the ED if I were you, or any other low mid voiced amp.

I believe the ED has a darker tone, but I, too, have not found the RA's channel 2 to be bright. Channel 1 can become thin if you dial back the gain.

Isn't that normal for most Mesa clean channels? I mean, first off, this is an EL34 amp. What do you expect? On a clean channel you are going to hear the characteristics of EL34s a lot. Second, Mesas always require a little gain to make the cleans sound warmer. Adding bass is rarely the answer. Think about it -- Mesa purposefully makes the gain control the most powerful. How all the other controls work rely on how little gain you have dialed in. The more gain, the less powerful the other controls on the EQ become. I am guessing this is also the case with the RA. At least, that is also how the amp seemed when I played it.

Mesas also don't conjure up many fans because of their darker tones. Sure, they sound fab on their own, but in a mix? I think you'll have to use your ears and your judgment when deciding on the RA. To my ears, and with my Gibsons, the RA sounded pretty darn nice. I played the amp a lot yesterday and loved it. I might buy one after all.

I'm not really a "Mesa" guy, as I like amps that aren't designed for metal. I do however love the ED, and really am starting to like the RA.

 

[Guitarbuff]

I am not surprised you feel the Royal is bright. Compared to the ED, I'm sure it will absolutely seem that way. The Royal is an amp with a distinct Mesa flavor, in a purely British circuit. When I tooled around on the Royal (which was a considerable two hours worth of jamming) I found it to not be bright at all. The amp has a ton of upper mids in it, but that just is the nature of the circuit.

I'd stick with the ED if I were you, or any other low mid voiced amp.

I believe the ED has a darker tone, but I, too, have not found the RA's channel 2 to be bright. Channel 1 can become thin if you dial back the gain.

Isn't that normal for most Mesa clean channels? I mean, first off, this is an EL34 amp. What do you expect? On a clean channel you are going to hear the characteristics of EL34s a lot. Second, Mesas always require a little gain to make the cleans sound warmer. Adding bass is rarely the answer. Think about it -- Mesa purposefully makes the gain control the most powerful. How all the other controls work rely on how little gain you have dialed in. The more gain, the less powerful the other controls on the EQ become. I am guessing this is also the case with the RA. At least, that is also how the amp seemed when I played it.

Mesas also don't conjure up many fans because of their darker tones. Sure, they sound fab on their own, but in a mix? I think you'll have to use your ears and your judgment when deciding on the RA. To my ears, and with my Gibsons, the RA sounded pretty darn nice. I played the amp a lot yesterday and loved it. I might buy one after all.

I'm not really a "Mesa" guy, as I like amps that aren't designed for metal. I do however love the ED, and really am starting to like the RA.

I love my RA! It is one amp where my PRS, Gibson and Fender guitars all sound great. Tone is very easy to dial in. I didn't notice a big difference in fatness when dialing in more gain on my LSS but it is very noticable with channel 1 on the RA. Provides great flexibility!

 

[lesterpaul]

I'm not really a "Mesa" guy, as I like amps that aren't designed for metal. I do however love the ED, and really am starting to like the RA.

sorry for any hijacking here, but it is vaguely related to op...Mesa has gotten the rep of a "metal" amp, but this is a misnomer-this has been argued to death around here, but the Mark amps, for example, were used in such a variety of different genres pre-Metallica(insert Keef Richards,LArry Carlton,etc)...esentially hotrodded Fenders
-the Morton vid shows the metal side of the RA, and therefore is marketed to a certain audience, but what IF LArry Carlton or Skunk Baxter was featured?..or what if Morton played a lot of his blues repertoire?
-just stating that the marketing seems to be counter-intuitive at times...or maybe they figure us old guys already know it all anyways..hell, ol' Doug has even stooped to name calling

 

[guitarrhinoceros]

I'm not really a "Mesa" guy, as I like amps that aren't designed for metal. I do however love the ED, and really am starting to like the RA.

sorry for any hijacking here, but it is vaguely related to op...Mesa has gotten the rep of a "metal" amp, but this is a misnomer-this has been argued to death around here, but the Mark amps, for example, were used in such a variety of different genres pre-Metallica(insert Keef Richards,LArry Carlton,etc)...esentially hotrodded Fenders
-the Morton vid shows the metal side of the RA, and therefore is marketed to a certain audience, but what IF LArry Carlton or Skunk Baxter was featured?..or what if Morton played a lot of his blues repertoire?
-just stating that the marketing seems to be counter-intuitive at times...or maybe they figure us old guys already know it all anyways..hell, ol' Doug has even stooped to name calling

I don't really know either way to be honest. Let me rephrase what I stated before to IT SEEMS TO ME that these amps are designed for metal. Either way, I'm loving the RA and ED. Haven't tried the TA yet though.

 

[lesterpaul]

yes,Rhino..both cool amps with more of the classic "British" thang-and I wasn't being critical,mind you-I think it is a great example of the "image" ,both post 'tallica and the rectumfryers
I really dig the RA-playing the TAnderson thru it was especially cool, because of the many different pickup configurations-tele twang? check jazzy cleans? check Hendrix-y neck pup magic? check humbucking crunch and saturated leads? check...and much simpler,IMO, than the MK V-I LOVE the tweed on MK V, but the RA really is easier to navigate, and such a crunch tone

 

[JOEY B.]

Just found out mine is coming in this Saturday. I guess I will see firsthand how bright the amp is.

after my experience with a fellow board member's amp, we were suprised there isn't more love for this beast-its next on my list of 'Boogers
-JB has changed some tubes, and don't forget that can really help dial these baies in with your existing equipment...maybe he has some posts on here regarding that(Joey B.)

FWIW, the only stock tube in my amp is the 12AT7. All the tone generator 12AX7's are either Ruby 12AX7AC5HG+ or Penta 12AX7M's with the phase inverter being a Sovtek 12AX7LPS. The power section is loaded with NOS Sylvania 6CA7's. No brightness issues whatsoever, but I am guilty of using my guitar tone knob, from time to time. :wink: The Blue channel "MASTER dimed and attenuated somewhat" is absoulutely blissful.

 

[J.J]

FWIW, the only stock tube in my amp is the 12AT7. All the tone generator 12AX7's are either Ruby 12AX7AC5HG+ or Penta 12AX7M's with the phase inverter being a Sovtek 12AX7LPS. The power section is loaded with NOS Sylvania 6CA7's. No brightness issues whatsoever, but I am guilty of using my guitar tone knob, from time to time. :wink: The Blue channel "MASTER dimed and attenuated somewhat" is absoulutely blissful.

Did the tube swap change the brightness much ? What guitar(s) do you use with the RA ?

I did play with the tone control on my guitar, it did help, but the tone started to sound farty.

Someone early in this thread mentioned pickup height. I do run the Mules fairly high as they are vintage low output. Since the RA has the gain to burn lowering the pickups may well take the edge off.

The ED usually gives me the opposite problem. It is heavy with bass in vintage low mode and needs the bass set low with the middle and trebble set high.

 

[lesterpaul]

FWIW, the only stock tube in my amp is the 12AT7. All the tone generator 12AX7's are either Ruby 12AX7AC5HG+ or Penta 12AX7M's with the phase inverter being a Sovtek 12AX7LPS. The power section is loaded with NOS Sylvania 6CA7's. No brightness issues whatsoever, but I am guilty of using my guitar tone knob, from time to time. :wink: The Blue channel "MASTER dimed and attenuated somewhat" is absoulutely blissful.

Did the tube swap change the brightness much ? What guitar(s) do you use with the RA ?

I did play with the tone control on my guitar, it did help, but the tone started to sound farty.

Someone early in this thread mentioned pickup height. I do run the Mules fairly high as they are vintage low output. Since the RA has the gain to burn lowering the pickups may well take the edge off.

The ED usually gives me the opposite problem. It is heavy with bass in vintage low mode and needs the bass set low with the middle and trebble set high.

..its worth a try with the Mules-i currently am using a VH-II in a LP Custom, and I found the sweet spot lower than other pups I have used in the past-I like to adjust using the clean channel , and then worry about fine tuning with the gain channel...if it sounds real good in other amps,though, it might not yield much of a chnge...

 

[JOEY B.]

Did the tube swap change the brightness much ? What guitar(s) do you use with the RA ?

The ED usually gives me the opposite problem. It is heavy with bass in vintage low mode and needs the bass set low with the middle and trebble set high.

I bought my mint condition RA-100 used, for $1300 without ever playing one. A risky move, but I knew that I could flip it if I didn't like it, maybe for a profit. I only play tested the amp with the stock tubes to verify that it worked as it should. Seeing as that I am not a big fan of the JJ preamp and Sovtek power tubes(in Mark Series Boogies), I chose to raid my tube stash to get my tones happening. The Penta 12AX7M's are great for taking some of the shrill highs and rounding them off. The Sylvania 6CA7's are legendary for tone and extremely reliable. My second choice for power tubes would be SED =C= EL-34's.

My main guitar in a 1971 Goldtop LP, with a few mods of the electronics(RS Guitarworks pots, treble bleeds, SD Pearly Gates neck and Custom Custom bridge pickups), bone nut, and Tonepros bridge and tailpiece.

I always found the ED blue channel could get muddy very fast, if the bass was set too high.


As has been said before, the attenuator can trim a bit off the highs, if need be.

 

[Assumer]

Now that I have mine, I have the treble at 12:00 on the clean and 11:00 on channel two. I am using the soak though. I think without it, the amp is bright but when the soak is used some of that goes away. The clean channel is killer with some soak added.

 

[J.J]

Every thing at 12:00 for the clean channel sounded great to me.

I fired up my old JCM which I have not really used for years now to see if that would shed any light. After replacing a preamp tube that had gone bad, I found the JCM to be way brighter than I remembered. I had to turn the trebble and presence down to 2 to get a good tone (and I like bright tones). The RA in vintage low with the gain at 11:00 would be well past the JCM dimed.

With my usuall settings, the ED sounded muffled and it took the trebble and mids set to 3:00 to get a similar tone.

What I have learnt from all this (with plenty of good tips from all you guys) is that my SG is on the brighter side of things and the RA is probably not as bright as I thought. The amp room at my shop has no sound treatment or damping with mostly bare walls. I always forget that things sound brighter in the shop than they do in most of the places I play.

Did the tube swap change the brightness much ? What guitar(s) do you use with the RA ?

The ED usually gives me the opposite problem. It is heavy with bass in vintage low mode and needs the bass set low with the middle and trebble set high.

I bought my mint condition RA-100 used, for $1300 without ever playing one. A risky move, but I knew that I could flip it if I didn't like it, maybe for a profit. I only play tested the amp with the stock tubes to verify that it worked as it should. Seeing as that I am not a big fan of the JJ preamp and Sovtek power tubes(in Mark Series Boogies), I chose to raid my tube stash to get my tones happening. The Penta 12AX7M's are great for taking some of the shrill highs and rounding them off. The Sylvania 6CA7's are legendary for tone and extremely reliable. My second choice for power tubes would be SED =C= EL-34's.

My main guitar in a 1971 Goldtop LP, with a few mods of the electronics(RS Guitarworks pots, treble bleeds, SD Pearly Gates neck and Custom Custom bridge pickups), bone nut, and Tonepros bridge and tailpiece.

I always found the ED blue channel could get muddy very fast, if the bass was set too high.


As has been said before, the attenuator can trim a bit off the highs, if need be.

Thanks for that information. I have some Penta 12ax7s, but so far I have not really used them as most of my amps have needed help up top. Now that you have reminded me, I might try them in the JCM and see what happens.

Iv'e been looking for a used RA to come up, but have not seen a single one yet. I think they have only been here for about 6 months though. I should look into the Marshall JVM too (someone talk me out of it :lol: )

 

[Assumer]

I actually like the JVM, at least the clean and crunch channels. I think it feels stiffer than the RA though.