LSS vs. Budda Superdrive II 18W

[Chris F]

I've spent some time now looking for a new amp, and mesa has been high on the list. Basically, now I've sort of circled out two amps, Lonestar Special 1x12 and Budda Superdrive II 18W 1x12. I'm a "bedroom" player, so both will give me more than plenty. Both have EL84's as a main part of their sound.

I know that the LSS offers WAY MORE flexibility, and I am really leaning towards that one. I know that this is a mesa forum, but from previous threads and answers, I see that people here are fairly objective (if there is such a thing).

Does anyone have experience with the Budda? Or even both against each other?

Thanks,
CF

 

[mtmartin71]

I've spent some time now looking for a new amp, and mesa has been high on the list. Basically, now I've sort of circled out two amps, Lonestar Special 1x12 and Budda Superdrive II 18W 1x12. I'm a "bedroom" player, so both will give me more than plenty. Both have EL84's as a main part of their sound.

I know that the LSS offers WAY MORE flexibility, and I am really leaning towards that one. I know that this is a mesa forum, but from previous threads and answers, I see that people here are fairly objective (if there is such a thing).

Does anyone have experience with the Budda? Or even both against each other?

Thanks,
CF

I've owned a SuperDrive 18 (Series 1) and now own the LSS. They're really two different amps. The SuperDrive's distortion really nails a modded Plexi tone (think Van Halen) and to me, is superior to the LSS in that respect. I think the Series II just balanced the channels more and also offered a mid scoop push-pull for a more modern sound. I regret selling it for losing the distortion. The reason I did sell it though is that I like power tube distortion and couldn't get it to give up the goods early enough. For 18W, this combo was VERY loud. I could never get the master past a 1/4 volume when using the distortion. Cleans were more Voxy whereas the LSS cleans have a bit more of a Fender character. Where the LSS really shines in comparing the two is flexibility. It has EQs for each channel. The Budda is shared. You have multiple power levels and individual masters and a global master with the LSS. The Budda shares the master and it's much harder dialing up a clean and distorted tone at matching levels. On the LSS crunch channel (which can also be set up to clone the clean channel if you choose), I go back and forth. Sometimes it sounds amazing to me, and sometimes it seems to get lost and lacks bite. When I get it in the zone though, it's a great and pleasing sound.

I may still buy a SD 18 head just to get back that distortion, which I really dug the voicing on. Hopefully this helps you out, or if you bought already, I guess this helps for the next guy.

Matt

 

[Chris F]

Thank you very much for your response, this is exactly the type I was hoping for. I always find it difficult to test amps in music stores, and tend to balance my decision-making with experiences from people like you. This was very helpful

 

[mtmartin71]

Thank you very much for your response, this is exactly the type I was hoping for. I always find it difficult to test amps in music stores, and tend to balance my decision-making with experiences from people like you. This was very helpful

No problem. It was cool to see a post where I actually had/have both amps. By the way, I gig out as a semi-pro so that's where part of my evaluation comes from. But we gig at lower volumes so that's relevant on the home front. Best of both worlds would be the SuperDrive distortion with the cleans and features of the LSS.

Which way are you leaning now?

 

[Chris F]

I certainly like the idea of flexibility of the LSS. The music I attempt to play ranges from Hendrix/Trower-like sounds, Led Zeppelin, SRV, ZZ Top, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Clapton, Blackmore, via 80s metal (iron maiden) to U2, and occasionally country-rock. I have numerous OD / distortion pedals (HBE Power Screamer, HBE Big D, TS808, Drivetrain, Tonebone Classic Distortion, Carl Martin Hot drive'n;boost etc) which could be thrown in front of it.

On the other hand, I like the idea of getting the OD / distortion from the amp. Then there is the "sound in my head", which lately has come from Joe Bonamassa (just wish his skills would rub of by listening to him), who I know uses Budda, which I believe is primarily for his overdriven / hendrixy-type of sounds. So I am still willing to give the Budda a chance.

How do you see the clean sounds on the Budda?

Again, your insight is much appreciated.

Chris

 

[LPClassic]

I have the 18 and 30 watts SD II. Both great amps and sound little different from each other being the 18 watts my favorite.

Regardng the cleans, they are rich harmonic but easy to get crunch overdrive, if you are looking great cleans this may not be you amp. For crunch to great dirstortions it is really great.

 

[mtmartin71]

I certainly like the idea of flexibility of the LSS. The music I attempt to play ranges from Hendrix/Trower-like sounds, Led Zeppelin, SRV, ZZ Top, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Clapton, Blackmore, via 80s metal (iron maiden) to U2, and occasionally country-rock. I have numerous OD / distortion pedals (HBE Power Screamer, HBE Big D, TS808, Drivetrain, Tonebone Classic Distortion, Carl Martin Hot drive'n;boost etc) which could be thrown in front of it.

On the other hand, I like the idea of getting the OD / distortion from the amp. Then there is the "sound in my head", which lately has come from Joe Bonamassa (just wish his skills would rub of by listening to him), who I know uses Budda, which I believe is primarily for his overdriven / hendrixy-type of sounds. So I am still willing to give the Budda a chance.

How do you see the clean sounds on the Budda?

Again, your insight is much appreciated.

Chris

My memory is a little fuzzier here, but LPClassic's response seems right on. I think the LSS cleans are glassier...again, more of a Fender EQ character to them. The Budda's cleans were solid but I woudn't say they were better. Maybe what it gets down to for you is what music you will primarily play. If it's mostly going to be some dirt and grit to your tone, then I think the Budda really shines there. Hell, I'm lurking on a SD18 Head for sale because I miss that distortion sound.

Matt

 

[Chris F]

This is a lot of help. Without any pedals in front of the LSS, in which "territory" does the drive channel take you? Some will say that the overdriven tones are a bit thin, and recommend pedals on the clean channel. But again, I guess it all depends on what you like.

Did any of you have problems with volume when switching between drive and clean "channels" on the SD II 18w?

 

[LPClassic]

On the SD30 II I notice a little more the jump on volume since I like to have the distortion saturated, but if I have them about the same no much problem, on the SD18 II head I don't have much of that problem, they are fairly similar in volume, of course the lead is a little higher but more controlable than in the 30.

 

[alantig]

My memory is a little fuzzier here, but LPClassic's response seems right on. I think the LSS cleans are glassier...again, more of a Fender EQ character to them. The Budda's cleans were solid but I woudn't say they were better. Maybe what it gets down to for you is what music you will primarily play. If it's mostly going to be some dirt and grit to your tone, then I think the Budda really shines there. Hell, I'm lurking on a SD18 Head for sale because I miss that distortion sound.

Interesting - and I'm not disputing your evaluation - because I have a SD 18 and a MkIV, and I end up using the Budda for the Fendery cleans. Usually for some kind of countryish/twangy chicken-substitute-picking parts.

I got the Budda when I went to buy a Mk IV - I'd already checked out the Boogie, but when I went to buy it, I suddenly got initimidated. The salesman showed me the Budda, and I monkeyed with it a bit, and he dropped the price a fair bit, and I went with that. A year or two later, I traded a guitar and an amp and got the Boogie, so now I've got the best of both worlds.

I'm just trying to figure out if I want a third world (well, fourth since I have the little Vox Brian May amp, too).

Alan

 

[Chris F]

That was a very tough choice :? I spent time in the store testing both the LSS and the Budda. I even left the store and came back some hours later for a new round of testing. I drove home with the LSS. Since I only play at home, and play many different styles, the flexibility of the LSS was what made the difference. I do however recognize that the drive/distortion on the budda was better. That will definitely be my next amp. A/B them would for me be the perfect match of sounds. Hats off to Budda....

I do think I will have great pleasures in the sounds coming out of the LSS.

Thank you guys for your insight and experience. It is now crystal clear which amp is on the top of my wish list.

 

[Chris F]

BTW, I was wondering if anyone of you who have/had Buddas have tried to get that type of distortion on your LSS using pedals? If so, which pedals do you recommend and do you run it through Ch1 or add it to Ch 2?

 

[timmerel]

You might also consider looking into NOS tubes for the LSS. They improve the sound (to my ears) enormously, particulalry on the drive channel.

Some drive sounds on the first couple of demo tracks here www.myspace.com/fudjmusic

Check out the tubes forum for discussion of potential tube changes

 

[Chris F]

Listened to your songs. Great work. There was almost an "David Gilmourish" quality to the sound and the sustain. I will certainly look at changing the tubes. That's a great tip which I will start investigating.

I did put a Homebrew Electronics Big D distortion pedal through Ch 1 at settings I like, and fiddled with ch 2 until I approached that sound. I came pretty close. Many has critizised the LSS for its "brown sound" in the OD/DS register, but I did find it relatively easy to get a variety of sounds with some experimenting. And as you said, I think some other tubes will harness it further.

Thanks,
CF

 

[phillyred79]

IMHO, you have to push the LSS a lot harder to give thicker distortions. The buddha just seems to be there already and honestly it sounds really good at low volume levels.

 

[timmerel]

You're welcome Chris, and thanks for the kind words.

Best of luck with it.