General delay question

[rmcfee]

Now that I am really digging this Mark V I am trying to get things sounding as good as possible.
Is it a better sound to put the delay in the effects loop, as opposed to putting it in front of the amp? Thanks.

 

[mejoshee]

Now that I am really digging this Mark V I am trying to get things sounding as good as possible.
Is it a better sound to put the delay in the effects loop, as opposed to putting it in front of the amp? Thanks.

yes, 1000000000000%

cheers on the awesome amp!

 

[eudaimonia02912]

In general, for almost any overdriven amp, delay will sound better in a loop than in front of an amp. Delay is really best used as a post-effect.

Do you want to add distortion to your echoes, or do you want to add echoes of your distorted sound to your distorted sound?

Let's say you're in channel 3, with the gain up. If you put a delay in front of the amp, then the amp will be fed your original note plus the progressively fading echoes of your note. It will then add gain, eq, etc., to each of these. Typically, this sounds mushy and weird, especially since the echoes aren't overdriven as much as your original note (because they are not as loud going into the gain stages).

In contrast, if you have the delay in the loop, then the gain has already been added to your original signal. Any EQ has already been applied. The delay then takes this sound and makes echoes of it. This is the most natural, normal delay sound.

Now, if you're using a clean tone, it won't make as much of a difference.

 

[SteveO]

Definitely in the loop. Unfortunately, the reverb circuit is pre-loop, so that can have an interesting affect on the delay (I prefer my reverb to be post delay).

 

[eudaimonia02912]

In general, here's how I would run effects:

In front of amp:
Fuzz (many fuzzes need to "see" the guitar and can't handle buffer stages before them)
Wah
phaser (this can also go in the loop)
overdrives

in loop:
chorus or flanger
delay
reverb

Some effects are to taste, such as a noise gate. (I like my noise gate last before the front of the amp, but many like them first in the loop.) Volume pedals are also to taste. A volume pedal in front of the amp can be used to control the amount of gain, whereas in the loop it's better for volume swells and violin sounds.

Other effects vary depending on use. E.g., when using the Digitech Whammy for octave bends, it's best immediately after the guitar. But if using it to play harmonies with a distorted guitar sound, it's best (in my experience) first in the loop.

 

[eudaimonia02912]

Definitely in the loop. Unfortunately, the reverb circuit is pre-loop, so that can have an interesting affect on the delay (I prefer my reverb to be post delay).

This is one of the main reasons I don't use the Mark's reverb. (The other reason is that I don't like spring reverb that much.)

 

[Heritage Softail]

Now that I am really digging this Mark V I am trying to get things sounding as good as possible.
Is it a better sound to put the delay in the effects loop, as opposed to putting it in front of the amp? Thanks.

Most say to go in the loop, after the distortion, but some pedals don't like a loop much. I have a Maxon 900 old purple delay pedal and it is a classic for good reason, but it does not get along with the MKV loop. It goes in front of the loop and it still sounds good, better on clean delays of course. The new Carbon Copy does great in the loop. Experiment and compromise. If it sounds good for your song, it's right.

 

[rmcfee]

I tried running a Line 6 DL4 in the loop but it doesn't work very well in the loop at all.

 

[mejoshee]

I tried running a Line 6 DL4 in the loop but it doesn't work very well in the loop at all.

could you explain? bad tone? weird noises? volume loss?

obviously, there's the effects send volume, if it sounds like it clips when you engage the fx loop, you might be overdriving the input of the dl4. do you have reasonable control over the output volume of the dl4? try bringing that up and bringing down the send volume from the mark v.

another thing might be that the mix is too wet from the dl4. try dialing back in a small amount of dry signal back in, if possible. otherwise you might need to consider a line mixer.

 

[rmcfee]

Hi Mejoshi. I have not experimented too much so i will do some more before I write off the Line 6 in the loop. The problem was that I couldn't get enough level from the Line 6.
However, I have been told that Line 6 modeling pedals generally don't work well in effects loops.
The pedals have a "mix" pot which blends the amount of wet and dry but there is no level control at all.
They are cool pedals for what they are. I will check it out some more. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Oldschool]

Line6 Modelers are NOT designed to work in and FX loop. They are instrument level, not line level, which the FX loop needs to see. The DL4 works great infront of the amp like it was designed to do!

 

[Heritage Softail]

Line6 Modelers are NOT designed to work in and FX loop. They are instrument level, not line level, which the FX loop needs to see. The DL4 works great infront of the amp like it was designed to do!

Is that also the case for by old Maxon 900 delay pedal? How do you look at an output number and determine if it is instrument or line level? That would be good to know in dealing my various old effects...

 

[th0rr]

Just to throw my 2 cents in, it depends on where your distortion is. If your like me, since I use both pedals and amp distortion, I put my delay in the loop. If you are using solely pedals to get your distortion it is fine to run the delay in front of the amp as long as it is after your distortion pedals.

Now I know some are already thinking, "Why on earth would you want to use pedals with your Mark V?" Different flavors. I can go from clean to overdrive without having to toggle modes in channel one. Or I can go from crunch mode in channel two to scream mode again without having to touch the toggle switch or change the gain. Channel 3 I leave alone, no pedals needed for me there. Sorry to go off topic but I get that question a lot.

 

[EricFeliciano]

Actually my Boss DD-3 works MUCH better in the loop than my Carbon Copy.. the Carbon Copy could not be balanced among all 3 channels. It worked great for my cleans but was no consistent at all with my lead channel.

The best thing to do I say is to try both! In front and in the loop. Both will yield different results.

 

[Oldschool]

Well, generally, for leads sounds you "want" the delay after distortion, whether that´s pedal or amp distortion. Eventhough I personally use od pedals with my Mark V for extra flavor, I think you would be mad not to want to use the lead sound from channel 3 (therefore the need for delay in the loop).

I personally use both, a TC2290 in the loop, and a Seymour Duncan delay in front of the amp...

 

[shogun]

Hey Rob, Steve here.. I run two different delays in my MKV, they work great. Check out the TC Electronics Nova Repeater, or Nova Delay. I use them both

 

[rmcfee]

Thanks Steve. I will look into those. I love my Line 6 but it can only go in front of the input.

 

[jb's 52]

Thanks Steve. I will look into those. I love my Line 6 but it can only go in front of the input.

If it sounds good, I say leave in the front. I use a EHX Stereo Memory Man and it sounds good to me in front as well as in the loop.
All my other pedals need to be in front. Plus, I'm lazy and in no hurry to run more cabling to the efx loop if I don't have to.